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The sensor inside the D4 is made by Nikon

Chipworks has a new report online for the Nikon D4 and the 16.2MP FX CMOS sensor inside (NC81366W) is made by Nikon. Similar to the D3, D3s, D700 and D3100, the sensor inside the D3200 was also made by Nikon. The D7000 did use a Sony sensor.

Few months ago there were some rumors that Aptina is developing a new full frame CMOS sensor for Nikon.

Update: another good source for sensor manufacturers (and other sensor related data) is sensorgen.info. According to the site, the sensor inside the D800 is made by Sony (no surprise here).

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  • LeGO

    Hope to see the same sensor in a D800 body.

    • D800Sensor WeakSause

      DXO mark rating is not reliable as they are sponsored by Nikon.

      and regarding Sensor, Nikon applies heavy internal software to hide the noise. Noise is def. there.

      • Craig W.

        Ordered one in mid July. It had the left focus problem. Sent it back for refund. Ordered another one in late July. Same thing–left focus issue. Also sent back for refund. Amazon customer service is excellent about this, but it’s still frustrating and time consuming. It’s a shame they can’t test for this before they ship them out.

        Still want a D800–but at full price, just want a defect-free one out of the box. Will try again in a month or so. Apart from the focus issue, it’s a remarkable camera. If its durable, it will be well worth the money.

        • St.

          You should send it to Nikon at first place.

          • Bruce

            Nikon does not have a confirmed universal fix for this. Nikon has not publicly acknowledged this problem. Many people have spent money and time sending their camera in multiple times to only receive it back unfixed.

            It’s much easier, and simply makes more sense, for a consumer paying $6,500 to return the faulty/lemon camera to the store for a refund, instead of playing games with Nikon.

            • Andrew

              Seeing as you are likely coming from the Canon camp, could you inform us about the status on the “light leak” with the 5D Mark III? I understand if you apply black tape to the camera it will solve the problem, please give us status on this critical issue.

            • Timothy

              @Andrew that comment could be applied anywhere to any company. Please don’t resort to pointing the fanboy finger. You sound like one yourself.

              I’ve been jerked around by Nikon before, same with many other companies.

        • Af issue anti-troll

          Why didn’t you just get the problem fixed..??????
          Refunding seems a bit stupid…..

          But then again…..you never owned a Nikon camera did you….

          • Craig W.

            Sometimes we get carried away but the sheer level of Brand Loyalty, Wow… i never knew how rough some of you folks are. I’m merely stating my experience with D800. This has saddened me hearing this from fellow Nikonian.

            • Rick

              All it matters is that Camera is a tool to achieve the result you are looking for.

              Forget all these brand loyal fanboys on either side, Canon or Nikon. Although i must admit there seems to be more Nikon Fanboys than for any other brand.

            • D800E & D4

              It would be bad enough if these posters like “Af issue anti-troll” were paid for their work posting asinine comments that there are no AF issues on the D800 but these people are doing it for free. Losers!

            • Trollz Suck

              BS, you’re a liar troll.

              Go away.

          • USA

            Seriously, you either a Nikon salesman trying to promote the brand or a really stupid fanboy that know nothing by nikon. What make you think Craig W is trolling? Is it because he had bad luck with the D800? He never mentioned anything about the D800 being inferior to other brands. I myself didn’t want to get the D800 because of the wait time, and also because of the AF issue that a lot of people are reporting. Boy, I must be the biggest troll on this planet. Dude, wake up! There are other things to do today besides Nikon.

            • Obvious troll is…

              And trolls never lie?

              Grow up bro.

        • http://drinkingmadeeasy.com/ Ric

          DRINK!

        • DeepC

          Craig,
          You should have tried sending it to Nikon. I sent mine and they are on it. See it this way, we always watch a movie of our favorite actor and we try to oversee small mistakes made in the movie, right?

          Same way Nikon made a $10000 competitor in $3000 body with an theatre quality video. If it needs a single time repair for a small issue, I think that is ok dude.

          What do you say?

          • Pablo Ricasso

            You are all a bunch of trolls.
            Let’s focus here, for a minute. The article is about the manufacturer of the sensor, not your alleged lack of focus or your wait time.
            Ms. USA, I have trouble believing that you ever thought about getting that camera. If you had lenses, you would still want it. If you didn’t have lenses, you would be looking for something in the sub thousand dollar range. You might take your own advice that you expressed in that last sentence.

            • Pablo Ricasso

              That posted in the wrong spot. It was intended for “USA.”

              I need to add that my opinion was initially that a bunch of third graders got on here occasionally, thinking that is would be funny to stir things up, but now it is apparent that I was mistaken. Someone sits patiently waiting for a new article to pop up. ANY article. Any article dealing with ANYTHING related to any Nikon Camera, and then spouts off a weak attack on whatever they perceive as a weak point. The person doing it generally has little or no photographic knowledge and that much is obvious from the post. The writing style indicates that it is the same couple or three people doing it over and over. There seems to be an attempt made to make new customers notice something that is an exception and something that is both fixable and easy to work around. Someone is encouraging people to return their cameras in an effort to put a financial burden on the retailer who carries the Nikon camera, essentially trying to throw a monkey wrench into a system. Someone is engaged in corporate economic warfare and they don’t care to what end they will go to in an attempt to accomplish their objective. And their objective is to bring my system down – to make my lenses, the best set imaginable, obsolete and nearly useless.
              While I don’t know on what level this has been encouraged, I have no doubt what company is pursuing the smear campaign.
              From now on I will purchase NOTHING that says “Canon” on it. If someone shooting a Canon wishes me to advise him or her about equipment, I will suggest switching, and then will be very detailed about why, and the reasons are extensive. If I see continued trolling, I will spend a few weeks going over some of the reasons why Canon SUCKS. When the batteries on my camcorders fail, I will look for third party substitutes. Barring that I will retire them by smashing them against a blunt hard object.
              It would be so much better for all of involved it that company put as much effort into producing a credible product as it does trying to malign those that do.

            • trollz Suck

              +1

              The trolls are trying to sound “Realistic” now.

            • Andrew

              +1

              Pablo, at some point the Admin has to weed some of these people out, but leave excellent responses like yours for others to read. I think Canon is under a lot of pressure and the sales of the D800 is decimating their competing cameras – though I would not go as far as saying the these trolls are officially planted at Nikon related sites. It is easy to tell that their (i.e. the trolls) IQ is not very high… but what do they care, the end justifies the means!

              It is good to see that you have changed your original theory. My initial thought was that you were new to Nikon Rumors and as a result did not realize that there were enough lemmings trolling this site to not warrant any type of artificial agitation to incite the regulars.

      • http://www.russbarnes.co.uk Russ Barnes

        Please go and find another forum you idiot, you are VERY VERY boring indeed. Try DPReview, there’s millions of trolls just like you on there already, though I’m guessing that’s EXACTLY where you came from. No one on here is remotely interested in your trolling or your idiotic views. The rest of the world knows the facts.

        • Martin/badLAFtroll

          As Hegel said: “If the facts do not fit to the theory, the worse for the facts”.
          Congrats, good philosophical background.

          • Martin/badLAFtroll

            Sorry, It was looking, like You have referred to post about AF problems.

            • Andrew

              You meant “light leak”?

      • Josh

        D800Sensor WeakSause

        What is your source for that information? Or are just assuming its true because your are a Canon fan boy and don’t like the results?

      • gt

        source? what makes you think the DxO Mark ratings are unreliable?

        You seem a far more sketch source than DxO Mark which is remarkably transparent about their test methods and results. You can literally compare charts of all of their results.

        or are you just a butt-hurt canon user? when will people stop wrapping their identities up with the camera the brand they happen to buy into? ITS JUST A CAMERA relax.

      • Jason

        Its the most noise free camera I’ve ever seen. It practically sees in the dark. This shot was taken at 3200 500mm with a 2x converter.
        http://www.flickr.com/photos/79492850@N00/7741754968/in/photostream

        Software or hardware the camera is absolutely brilliant.

        • http://www.robertash.com Robert Ash

          Jason, your work is amazing. Absolutely beautiful. The fellow you’re responding to doesn’t seem to know a D4 from a D800 (the admin’s article is about D4 sensor but that poster’s pseudonym says D800) but however I got the oppty to see your beautiful work I’m sure glad it happened!

      • Canonfanboy butthurt

        once again you canon trolls are the first to post and complain. The D800 has better dynamic range and color then the 5dm3, so eat it. 5dm3 is all about noise reduction software wise, so it does a lot of raw cooking. They anything over 25-52k iso is raw cooking noise reduction on the raw.

        • any name i like

          No, the person who’s doing this just continuously rides on whatever the first post is.

          Admin, please consider registration (confirmed via real email) for posting here.

          The trolls are running/ruining the place and the animosity created by anonymity is very high.

      • http://nikonrumors.com/ [NR] admin

        DxO Mark sponsored by Nikon? I don’t think so.

        • Troll Interceptor

          “D800Sensor WeakSause” and “Craig W” are one and the same.

        • Troll Interceptor

          I am not Troll.

          • Troll Interceptor

            Yes you are, Craig W.

            You pitiful little boy.

        • Ray

          NR Admin, any plans to do something about the ever increasing troll problem? It’s a rare day that I bother coming into the comments, and it’s affecting the credibility of the site as a whole, tbh.

      • Mock Kenwell

        Ugh. I wonder how many of these issues are real. I’ve been shooting the D800 for two months now. It blows my mind and no issues apart from a less than stellar auto WB.

        • Sky

          Quite a lot.
          In every single review I read in Poland D800 got some issue – including 2 large, notable reviews pointing out a focusing issues.
          And well… considering that cameras for reviews in largest local media are usually hand-picked? It doesn’t look very well for Nikon.

      • Michael

        Not true. They are very true at all times. You have to comprehend what they mean by screen and print. Screen means SNR for each pixel. Print means SNR for the entire image. Screen will most likely has the same conclusion as you 100% noise viewing tests. But it is not reliable. To know the real amount of noise of an image, you have to look at Print. Print is what everyone usually sees in DxOMark. They contradict the 100% tests. But they’re accurate.

        Read this:
        http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/About/Sensor-scores/Viewing-conditions

        • Fred

          DXO are not willing to come forth with many of their measurement system information. You can find comments along these lines in their forums.
          They also make computational adjustments to arrive at their ‘print’ results. But, as most know, one cannot just derive a set of equations and state they are accurate without actually comparing the calculated results vs experimental data – and DXO have not performed this basic accuracy test!
          So, to reliably report ‘print’ results they either have to physically measure the S/N, DR etc from prints or provide scientific evidence that their results are accurate as per the above.
          One thing for sure though is that if one reduces all camera sensors down to 1 pixel I doubt you’ll see the the difference in any sensor :-)

          • JED

            Strange that others have performed the same tests as DXO and arrived at the same results then…

    • Richard

      Oh, you silver tongued devil!

  • lorenzo

    Great! I thought they were from Sony instead. D4 is too expensive for me.

    Off subject: before you guys are giving me a “troll” connotation, can I ask a question about the LT AF on the D800/E?

    I know that in the majority of cases Nikon can fix them but I don’t want to risk or send a new camera to repairs.

    Sorry Admin, but I missed if anyone said that the new arrivals still have the problem or not or if there is some hope that it has definitively fixed at the factory.

    The whole story has been put to silence. Any news? I hope my question doesn’t restart a troll war :-) that was NOT my intention. Thanks.

    • Troll Interceptor

      I’ve been in touch with Nikon distributor in Australia, while they had few isolated incidents some months ago, no AF issue had been reported in recent weeks. They sell in between 60-90 of D800/E per month in Australia.

    • Troll Interceptor

      BTW, you can ignore my user handle, I’m not calling you a troll or whatever, it’s just the login name I use in general :)

      • lorenzo

        Interceptor, I liked your UID! Thank you for your reply.

        At least buyers in Australia can be a bit more relaxed. Unless I missed it, I didn’t read a similar news in the US, yet.

        This forum is tired of LT AF trolls but unfortunately those who have got new good working camera don’t post: “My camera just came and works fine, serial number 300xxxx” – I never understood why the serial # is such a secret to be posted with the last 3-4 digits masked, is there a link with credit cards? :-)

        Thom Hogan started a poll a while ago; I didn’t see any results on his site, neither he wrote that everything is O.K. now. Nikon is still silent.

        I have never been a lucky person (got a lemon D100, then a lemon D300S that after 2 years of come and go to Service 7 times is still not working) and I am quite sure that, unless the bug has been fixed in Japan, I will get one of those D800E that Nikon cannot fix even after 3 times (this is a troll sentence) :-)

        The order I had for the D800E has been cancelled 2 months ago; I wait for a good samaritan or a serious announcement online to re-order.

        Regards, -l.

        • any name i like

          No offense intended. But are you SURE you’re getting lemons?

          It seems very unlikely/unlucky to get so many. Maybe (no offense) you’re making mistakes? Maybe you’re seeing a left AF issue that’s not really there because of all the talk about it?

          • lorenzo

            Yes, I am sure.

            The problems with the lemons were different: first the D100 underexposed 4 fstops, corrected still underexposes 2 fstops (the EV is on 00); then after they replaced the sensor, images became blueish, the WB is messed up, photos are blurred, LCD is blue!

            A similar story happened to the D300s, that sensor also was replaced on my request for Amp Glow. After that the camera often overexposes, all photos are blurred.

            As this LT AF bug on he D800s seemed pretty common (I never had a D800), I just didn’t want to try my luck again, or lack of it.

            I have been taking photos since 1971, please believe me.

          • lorenzo

            I wanted to be more precise:
            “I have been taking photos since 1971″ with Nikon, but started photography in 1957 with my dad’s Agfa. I later had a Nikon F2, F3, F4 (a bunch of point and shoot cameras) and never had any major problem. I own a park of Nikon lenses and I trust Nikon, but even if I hadn’t all this equipment I would never go Canon – just dislike’m.

            Unfortunately my misluck started in the US, where I came in 1983 from Europe to live here.

            No offense taken :-)

    • http://drinkingmadeeasy.com/ Ric

      -passingbottle.mov-

      • BartyL

        DRINK!

    • Michael

      Definitely not from Sony. Sony would never produce a sensor with such high read noise.

      • Sky

        LOL :D

        It’s not “made by Nikon” either as Nikon doesn’t have any sensor manufacturing capability.
        Unless they got secret base on the dark side of the moon.

  • Paul

    Will the D600 have a Nikon sensor?

    • George

      No, D600 will have the same Sony sensor that D3X has.

      • gonzalo

        how are you so sure?

        • gt

          reality: he isn’t.

          I hate how people state things as fact on here when they are just uninformed idiots. The rest of us, including Nikon Rumors Admin, don’t know either — but at least we don’t pretend like we have all the facts

          • EGGZZ

            Furthermore, there is no camera called 3DX….

            So you can be pretty sure that this post is BS

            • EGGZZ

              …as in discontinued….I mean….

            • Nikon user

              Oh yes there is, but not a Nikon model…;)

              Give it a few weeks.

              http://www.canonrumors.com/2012/08/canon-eos-3d-x-cr1/

            • Ex-Canon User

              Ha Canon rumours will post anything. His “CR1″ rating means this is just total BS/dreaming that someone thought up and emailed to him.

              He’ll basically post anything and everything he hears. NR has a much better track record.

            • Michael

              Rumors and plausibility aside, I think Canon Rumors have a much better designed site than Nikon Rumors, other than the comment section.

      • http://www.russbarnes.co.uk Russ Barnes

        It’s plausible and it’s the thing that stops me buying a D3X as a backup to my D800. If it turns out the D600 has the sensor of the D3X then I would jump to buy one.

      • Josh

        The D3X sensor is like 4 years old. I doubt Sony even makes them anymore.

      • Fred

        As I understand it the D3X used a sensor with off-chip ADC’s. The high pixel level was thus ‘cajouled’ by an extremely expensive route. Thus it is extremely unlikely that Nikon could afford (or want to) use this same sensor.

    • nuno santacana

      I don’t care as long it has better High ISO than D700 & D800.

      Sadly I’m beginning to doubt the announcement of D600 in Photokina.

      • Twaddler Belafonte

        I would be happy with high ISO as good as d700 or d800(!+!+ yes). Just give me 24mpx@full-frame for $2000 or less.

      • D800 iso is good

        Dude, the D800 has high iso approaching D3s levels. You don’t judge ISO by looking at pixel level, you look at it at a given print/file size. Downsized to 12MP the D800/E is very close to the D3s. At pixel size (100% viewing on a full sized image) it’s very close/better to the D700.

  • http://www.pbase.com/jctangney John Tangney

    While the chip says NIKON on it that does not necessarily mean they “made” it. They may have designed it or modified a design from somewhere else and had it fabricated for them. BTW: Along with a full size CMOS sensor, Adaptiva also has a high performance 16 MP APS-C sensor, the MT9H004. The specs on it make it look like a very nice possibility for a D400! :)

    • PHB

      Correct, and the fact that a sensor doesn’t say Nikon does not mean anything either.

      Nikon does not have a fab, therefore no sensors are made by Nikon. As far as we know, all CMOS sensors to date have been made in the Sony fab. Building a fab is a very capital intensive project and there is really no point in Sony and Nikon both building one. Given the way Japanese businesses work it is pretty likely that Nikon made a pretty sizable investment in the Sony fab in order to guarantee access to a certain amount of capacity for Nikon and a guarantee a customer for Sony.

      I would not read much into the lack of the name ‘Nikon’ on the D7000 sensor. It might mean that it is a Sony design that Nikon bought, it might mean that it is a Nikon design that they sold to Sony. Given where Sony is in the DSLR space right now I would think it rather unlikely they would be investing much in sensor R&D.

      Don’t read anything into the fact that the Sony Fab gets to see the Nikon masks when they make the sensor either. The fab will be a different business unit from the DSLR group anyway. Everyone knows what everyone else is selling by buying reports from the likes of chipworks anyway.

      • Sky

        As far as we know, all CMOS sensors to date have been made in the Sony fab” – That’s not truth. In past Kodak made some, currently Aptina and Panasonic got manufacturing capability.
        Considering though that no sources so far linked D4 sensor with Sony – I wouldn’t bet that it’s Sony-made sensor. Besides – it’s characteristics aren’t in line with any known Sony sensors (unlike those from D800 or D3200).

        • GrumpyDiver

          I believe that Canon also has a fab and does make its own sensors. Kodak sold their sensor business last year (to an investment company, Platinum Equity) and I believe that they still only make CCD sensors.

          Absolutely correct about the fab work being farmed out. Nikon has a design team, but does not manufacture any chips. So far as I know the Expeed image processor series are Fujitsu Milbeaut image processor based. There are many big-name companies that don’t have their own fabs; AND, nVidia, and the list goes on.

    • Markus A

      Thank you for being the first poster to actually post something related to the topic: the D4 sensor.

      The first 50 comments are about the D800, AF Issues, DxOMark sponsorship, et al.

      This development regarding the D4 sensor is indeed interesting as critics (read Canon trolls) are always looking for some way to discredit Nikon huge achievements pointing out sensor origins from Sony, etc.

      • Sky

        I never understood how using Sony sensor can discredit anyone? They are either clueless or just idiots.

        Everyone aware of what’s going on in industry know that Sony sensors are best of the best. Top of the board sensors. It doesn’t get any better that that.

        So if anything – NOT using Sony sensors can be a way to discredit some company.

    • Fred

      +1 on Nikon having no sensor fabrication facility. It is moss likely a Nikon designed (or modified) sensor made by Sony (or possibly another fab facility).
      Yes, that Aptina chip might find it’s way into a D400 (or such) pro DX body. The DR possibilities look really good.

  • David

    Can’t beleave there is still no new news on a D400, 80-400 VRII AF-S, 300/4 VR.

    There has to be something??????

  • Chris Peters

    What does this statement mean?

    In my view, this sensor is not really a good one and thus not a good advertisement for Nikon! So far, several tests have pointed out that the noise of the D4 is too strong, even a Canon 5D III for a third of the price of the D4 has got a better noise level than the D4. I am totally confused about that what Nikon did with the sensor of the D4 in that point?! Apart from all other professional features of this camera, which are of course of interest, the noise level is one of the most important factors for a digital camera and it stopped my willingness to purchase the D4. Thanks god that I keeped my D3s!

    • gonzalo

      Band Noise on 1DX and 5DMK3….

      • http://www.russbarnes.co.uk Russ Barnes

        Exactly, and poor DR too.

    • KnightPhoto

      Not sure where you got “info” that D4 is inferior to 5Diii with respect to noise, but none of it is true ;-)

      It is a GREAT sensor!

      • http://StevenGeorges.com Steven Georges

        Agree, I’ve shot with the D3s for 6 months and have owned a D4 since April. As a newspaper photographer, high ISO is something depend on for my everyday work. I’m very happy with the lack of noise, and 16 MP’s is a bonus compared to the D3s.
        To be honest, I have no knowledge as to what Canon is doing.

    • http://www.russbarnes.co.uk Russ Barnes

      Your statement re the 5DIII is WAY off the mark. Are you talking JPEGS? Canon’s in camera noise reduction CRUSHES detail as we all know. The D4 is light years ahead of the 5D series in RAW, though it is true that it has been shown that the D3S might be a nose ahead of the D4 but only at the highest ISOs. The difference was put down to the differing resolutions of the respective sensors in anything I’ve read, small fry as that may be.

      • http://www.thejordancollective.com CaryTheLabelGuy [NR]

        The D4 actually does out-perform the D3s in most ways, but does suffer from slightly more Chrominance Noise at high ISOs. The D4 has less Luminance Noise and MUCH better detail retention at all ISOs, not to mention better colorimetry at all ISOs. The D4 files handle much better noise reduction as a result and need less luminance NR than the D3s, while needing slightly more chrominance NR than the D3s. Luckily, chroma noise does not destroy detail like luma noise does.

        When it comes to low ISO, the D4′s sensor totally smashes the D3s in every way. Better in every aspect.

    • Calibrator

      1) Where I live the 5DMIII costs half of the price of the D4 and not a third of it.
      2) What images did you compare – JPGs or RAW files?

    • umesh

      I think that canon trolls have become more crafty and subtle. They have also started claiming to own Nikon equipment. If you actually had D3s you would know the truth.

      • Troll 3.14159265359

        +1 totally agree

      • Chris Peters

        Why you are calling me a “Canon troll”? I love to keep my D3s, as mentioned before and I never owned anything from Canon in my whole life! Needless statement from your side!

        • jake

          Chris,obviously, you have never shot D4 because if you have, you know it is better than the D3s from ISO100 to about ISO6400.
          But anyway, the D4 sensor is quite good and the ISO100 alone makes it a worthy update to the D3s, I loved the D3s but I always wanted ISO100 in that camera.

    • babola

      “In my view, this sensor is not really a good one and thus not a good advertisement for Nikon! ”

      Stick to your day job please, being a comedian doesn’t suit you well.

    • http://www.thejordancollective.com CaryTheLabelGuy [NR]

      Uh, say what? Drinking the Canon Kool-aid, I see? What makes you think the 5DIII’s sensor out-performs the D4′s? If you’re talking about OOC JPEGs, we all know that Canon uses insane amounts of NR that totally destroys detail and then attempts to correct the mush with gobs of sharpening which adds lots of awesome artifacts all over the files. With the amount of NR and sharpening used in OOC 5DIII JPeG files, it would make a Nikon D3000 @ ISO-12,800 look amazing (to you Canonites).

      I’ve got a shoot out between the D4 and D3s coming soon. Stay tuned to [NR] if you care to see the results. I sold my D3s and am keeping the D4, if that gives you a clue and we all know how amazing the D3s is.

      And since we’re on the subject of Canon’s latest offerings, let’s chat a bit about the 1Dx. The D4 out-performs the 1Dx at base ISO and high ISO, so if what you’re saying is true, the $3500 overpriced 5DIII out-guns the $7000 overpriced 1Dx? The Kool-aid must be spiked over there.

      • Jabs

        @Cary – It would seem that Canon had to ‘hide’ there 1DX Pro camera so as to not let us test it ourselves before the just concluded Olympics. Seems like the D4 wiped the floor with it too there. Canon needs to go back to the drawing board and have an answer for the D4, the D800, D800E and even the upcoming D600 – all hard tasks too. They need to start with a digital pipeline like how Nikon has Expeed 3 and then make new sensors that can compete.

      • Chris Peters

        Thanks Cary,
        your statement seems to be the only one which contains real knowledge, instead of stupid aggressivity of others, which is obviously the standard in that forum.

        I wrote a second statement below in which I mentioned from which source I got my information. When looking carefully at the provided pictures of this comparison, I could not find that the details in the Canaon pictures are “destroyed”. But frankly speaking, I only can see pictures in a printed magazine, nothing more in detail.

        As I also wrote in my second statement, a Nikon employee and me compared the noise performance of the D4 with this one of my D3s during a trade show, only using the camera’s own displays. We both were very badly suprised about the noise performance of the D4. In that way, I am really interested in the results of your upcoming comparison. How can I get access to this?

        As for the 1Dx, sorry, but I do not know this camera in detail and can nothing say about it.

        • Calibrator

          > Thanks Cary,
          > your statement seems to be the only one which contains real
          > knowledge, instead of stupid aggressivity of others, which is
          > obviously the standard in that forum.

          You know, Chris: Some people in this forum are overly aggressive. I don’t know if it’s their hormones or their professional elitism.

          However, how can one not become aggressive if one has to read people reiterating something they either read in magazinzes (OFTEN PAID BY ADVERTISEMENTS – in case you don’t get my messsage) or “experienced first hand” like this:

          > a Nikon employee and me compared the noise performance
          > of the D4 with this one of my D3s during a trade show,
          > only using the camera’s own displays.

          Say what? “Comparisons” using the camera display?

          At first I thought you meant that as a joke but have you (who complains about people not being blessed with knowledge) the slightest clue *what* you are comparing this way?

      • jake

        ignore the trolls rather than taking yourslef down to their level.

    • Michael

      You don’t know much. Canon applies increasingly heavy noise reduction on their RAW files every generation. They couldn’t really increase low light performance much, and they now trick people through noise reduction algorithms.

      • Calibrator

        Do you have a link (comparison or something like that)?
        I know that they put our smoothened JPGs but RAWs?

    • Sky

      What Nikon did with D4 is most likely is choosing cooperation with other company than Sony.

      • jake

        and it is a good thing to say goodbye or fuck off to Sony.

  • KnightPhoto

    Thanks Admin for the info. on the D4!

  • Jabs

    Old but welcome news – look at this web site:

    http://www.sensorgen.info/

    • http://nikonrumors.com/ [NR] admin

      Good source – the D800 sensor is made by Sony as expected:

      http://www.sensorgen.info/NikonD800.html

      • MB

        Says who? Sensogen? Is it enough for someone just to post something on the internet and this is the ultimate truth?
        It is another story if someone like Chipworks post an image that proofs it.

      • jake

        it is bad , if it is really true , I think Nikon should stick with Aptina or Renasus or Toshiba or even Micron is better than Sony.

        if Nikon depends too much on Sony sensors, Sony will take over or manipulate Nikon.

    • http://nikonrumors.com/ [NR] admin

      Thanks for the link, I will add this to the post.

  • rjbell78

    I’m not sure having the name on it makes it Nikon either, but its very good news if it is. You got to feel a little uneasy with one of your biggest competitors supplying such a key component.

  • John Doe

    When is the D5 coming out????? *runs for cover*

  • Chris Peters

    Hi Folks,
    please cool down a little bit!

    As for the D4 and 5D III comparison, e.g. the current issue of Germany’s c’t magazine “Digitale Fotografie” contains an official comparison and explicit pictures and analyses. I also read about the D4′s high(er) noise level in different web forums, don’t ask me which ones, I forgot.

    Russ + Calibrator,
    I am not sure which pictures were compared, I must double check the test. It is weeks ago I read it.

    Russ,
    when it comes to the comparison between D4 and D3s, I have to answer back! It was in April this year, I visited for business reasons the NAB show in Las Vegas, during which also Nikon had got a booth and displayed the D800 and D4. I had the chance together with a Nikon employee to compare the D4 and my D3s directly! We adjusted all parameters equally and had used the same lenses, the 24-70/2.8. We took various pictures from darker areas of the booth and from the down side of the roof of the hall. After that we compared the pictures only on the camera’s own displays at 100%, nothing else or better was available in that siuation.
    I can honestly tell all of you that I was shocked by the results! Before that comparison, I really wanted to try to get a D4 directly from the booth with a “special deal”. After that I was happy that I didn’t try it. The difference was so cleary visible that also the guy of Nikon has been ashamed, because in advance he told me that the noise floor is of 50% lower as this one of the D3s! That was really a strange experience and after that the guy of Nikon did not talk to me anymore.

    And Russ,
    we compared at ISO200 – not at higher ISOs. I do not know from where you got your information. But believe me, I am not writing this to spent my time, I want to inform you.

    But maybe there was a sensor defect on the D4, who knows???

    • Green?

      We will not cool down. We’re just getting started!

      • Chris Peters

        This really supports the discussion!

        • Green?

          YES! I didn’t read!

    • jake

      hey, Chris , thanks for the info but how can I read the German mag you mentioned here ?

  • Niktard

    Since both cameras have the green tint issue I’d say both d4 and d800 sensors are made by Nikon. Thanks for giving us POS cameras Nikon. Thanks, for nothing.

    • fifi

      Please check the facts! LCD screen has tint ‘issue’, not the camera itself! Where did you see LCD monitor with TRUE colors which costs less then 5000$?

    • King of you all

      Drama queen.

    • jake

      no, only the D800 and E have the green tint issue , the D4 does not share that at all.

  • Niktard

    I bet if Nikon had build a good camera this time around the d3s and d700 would have come down in price on the used market. They did not. Figure it out for yourself. Idiots.

    • PAG

      Why would they come down in price? They are already lower priced than the D4 and D800. Maybe they are all just good cameras now at different price points, ya’ think? I’ll try to explain this with a very, very simple analogy (sorry for the big word “analogy”). Toyotas hold their value very well even though there’s a new model every year. Why? Because a 10-year Toyota is still a very good car. Buicks? Not so much.

      So maybe, just maybe, there are photographers out there that can actually take pictures with a mere 12MP that don’t look like your niece’s crayon drawings and therefore decide to save money by not running to the newest and more expensive gizmo. Now I’m not assuming you are in this category, but I’m pretty sure those people exist. Actually, I’m pretty sure a LOT of them exist.

      Next time you might not want to post a comment until ya’ thunk it through.

    • Kimbra

      Because all of Nikon’s pro-level DSLRs are exceptional devices and people still use even the older and outdated models. There’s no reason why the new camera be it D800 or D4 should push the prices of older models below the levels they’re already selling at. Next time think before you decide brain dump.

      Not sure who’s an ‘idiot’ here…niktard.

    • http://www.flickr.com/photos/jan_f_rasmussen/sets/ Jan F. Rasmussen

      I think these guys are not Canon-trolls at all, they are D700-trolls trying to keep the second hand price of D700 up, so they can sell their own well and better afford the D800 (or D4) ;-)

    • jake

      in my area used mint condition D3X /D3s are really cheap now I think because of the D4 and D800E.

  • Dimitrii1130

    i still believe that D3200′s sensor is from sony and D4′s is from aptina.
    Nikon maybe just learned to write Nikon on the sensors^^

  • rotebro

    It’s certainly not made by Nikon, because they don’t own a factory to massively produce DSLR sensor. D3/D700 sensor is also not made by Nikon, it is made by a now declining compnay called Renesas. All of this is fairly common sense in Japan, but still many uninformed Americans believe it is made by Nikon. The right thing to say is that it is “designed” by Nikon. The designers are different from makers who realize the ordered design.

  • rotebro

    I wrote that it wasn’t made by Nikon, because it is fairly common sense in Japan. No informed Japanese believe that it is made by Nikon because they don’t own a factory to produce them. But this Nikon rumors admin has erased my comment. I think he didn’t like my comment because he is employed to say something good about them.

    • jake

      as I used to work in Thailand , I know that and most of not only japs but many Thais also know it, it was Renesas.
      and now, Nikon is trying to get Toshiba work for them on next sensor development project.

      I think Thom Hogan once pointed out this too in his site in this April or May.

  • umesh

    Has anybody checked out the true iso ratings on the D800 on sensorgen site. Can it deviate so much?

    • Kimbra

      These days anyone can post anything they wan’t on their web site.
      Gullible folk will always fall for that kind of stuff.

  • Julian

    Peter (admin),

    Would you answer 2 questions:

    1) Do you have any affiliations, direct or indirect with Nikon?
    2) Why do you remove posts related to Rockwell or Lloyd yet leave all the other drible untouched.

    Please honour me with an answer.

    Julian

    • http://nikonrumors.com/ [NR] admin

      I am not affiliate with Nikon in any way. Any discussion that includes Rockwell will turns this thread into a nightmare. The comments on NR lately need a lot of moderation. I will soon change the commenting system and if this doesn’t fix the problem, I will start requiring registration in order for a reader to post a comment. You have to understand that comments that are not related to the topic just prevent other readers to find meaningful information.

      • any name i like

        Please make registration mandatory.

        It will save a lot of problems if people have to use their real emails (instead of being about to put any name or email they like… just like this post).

        :D

        • any name i like

          *able

        • Calibrator

          “registration in order for a reader to post a comment”

          This won’t solve anything as we are not under fire from 10-year-olds or automated marketing bots.

          Viral marketers are known for creating lots and lots of registered accounts to be able to post their stuff and this will happen here, too.
          And, yes, all of these accounts have working email addresses as they *live* by this, paid for by viral markerting agencies (there are lots of them!).

          Dedicated trolls also do this because their payback is “fun dollars”.

          Also forum software isn’t so advanced, yet, to automatically filter out trolls and viral marketers – heck, they even can’t really filter out sexual or racial harrassments automatically, yet. This still has to be done manually to be done right.

          The only thing to prevent most of the viral advertising and trolls here would be to make the posters post under their real name and send in a scan or photo of their passports to verify it.
          This of course will kill the forum for 99% of the posters (including informants that can’t post under their real name) but this could be the way to establish NR as a site for people with a higher dedication and perhaps expertise?
          But will NR generate enough hits that way? Probably not.

          Therefore only one real alternative exists at the moment:
          Learn to live with the trolls and try to not get influenced by viral marketers.

          • Fake name

            That’s like saying a lock won’t keep out a dedicated thief so why bother locking the door.

            It’s about slowing them down. Also people can be banned then. Also posters won’t want their reputation screwed up by posting trolling/insulting posts so much.

            Sure it won’t stop trolls, but it’ll make it one or two steps harder to do so.

            Informers can contact admin directly I’m sure. They don’t need to post in these comments.

            • http://nikonrumors.com/ [NR] admin

              Correct, I have a contact form where you can email me without providing an email address.

      • hi

        you can try begining with moderating the first post, then see how much it helps, I think sonyalpharumors has it

      • lorenzo

        Totally agree, Peter! Let’s do it.
        Possibly I also will make the email public, so people can’t name idiots others, start insulting or going on inherent topics just because they are anonymous.

        I like your forum to read real news and facts, there is a lot of BS, instead.

        BTW, my name and my email are real.

        • BartyL

          I don’t think you have thought your proposition – making email addresses public – through. Having seen the behaviour of some that post here, do you really want them sending stuff directly to your email address?

          • No more trolls

            Yeh don’t make that public, but make it available to admin for banning purposes.

      • Zeke

        I don’t think registration alone will help. All the comment sections on newspaper sites require it and they’re completely overrun by angry cranks, too.

        What would be great is a scoring system like the one they’ve got on Slashdot. All the garbage posts get low scores and simply don’t show up by default.

    • Pablo Ricasso

      Yeah, I don’t think someone who was employed by Nikon would let so many idiots come on here and post the trash that they do REPEATEDLY. This thing wouldn’t connect to “photo rumors” and it wouldn’t be discussing the latest gadgets from… ahem… gag… other companies.

      • BartyL

        If more of the ‘serious’ posters here (yourself included) did not feed them, there would be fewer trolls.

        • BartyL

          MakIng people register will also stop people from impersonating people.

          Right Barty?! ;) :P

          • http://nikonrumors.com/ [NR] admin

            Yes, you have to register or use your social media login on many big blogs/sites.

          • BartyL

            Yes Barty, I agree. It would put a stop to people writing things in other people’s names. In this case you have used it constructively, but we’ve all seen recent examples of malicious use.

  • http://www.tayvinknightphoto.com Dallas photographer

    Does it really matter who makes the sensor? If it’s good, it’s good.

    • PeterO

      Amen to that! Imagine for a moment Michelangelo painting the Sistine Chapel. Then imagine other painters doing nothing but arguing ad naseum about the quality of his brushes and paints. This is what goes on here most of the time. Sad.

      • BartyL

        Oh great, another Michelangelo Fanboi. I don’t think you’ve ever even seen a fresco, or you’d realise that Bosch totally aced him. Back to Michelangelo Rumours for you :)

        (I guess one good thing about widespread illiteracy in times past was…fewer trolls!)

        • PeterO

          Sorry BartyL but I’ve seen more paintings of the masters than I can remember. I visited as many art galleries and musuems as possible when I lived in Europe.

          However, that wasn’t even the point of my post. Personally I think Bosch is awesome, but what was he smoking?

          • BartyL

            PeterO, before we get into a ‘who’s is bigger’-style argument about bygone painters I should probably clarify my first post.

            My point wasn’t about whether Bosch was better than Michelangelo (they are both great and you’re right, Bosch was weird), but the tendency for debates here to descend into petty tribalised tit-for-tat. In other words, I was re-stating your point by adaptation.

            • PeterO

              “but the tendency for debates here to descend into petty tribalised tit-for-tat. ”

              Indeed BartyL, I think we’re both on the same “canvas” about this issue. :-)

  • http://www.slickpic.com/u/AlphaWhiskey Alpha Whiskey

    Man, so much angst over gadgets and technology. The best camera is always the one you have with you :)

    http://www.slickpic.com/u/AlphaWhiskey/photoblog/post/TheBestCamera

  • aham

    noise vacum cleaner..

    • BartyL

      brandy sand paper

  • danny vigor

    Nikon doesn’t directly produce sensors. If it has Nikon stamped on the chip is most likely produce by Renesas.

  • http://ronscubadiver.wordpress.com Ron Scubadiver

    A tech can pull the sensor out of a camera and find “Nikon” stenciled on it, but all that means is the sensor is exclusive to Nikon and the foundry was directed to place that language on it. Most likely the sensor is a collaboration of Nikon, Sony and a third party foundry.

  • Thatsimportant?

    As long as the sensor is good, I don´t give a hoot about who makes the sensor.

  • Otaku

    Again this time it is a sony sensor labed as Nikon.
    Those Exmor Sensors are in fact much better than what Canon makes – Canon stands still while sony improves step by step

  • Ton

    From the pictures I estimate a pixel pitch of ~ 14 µm while I was expecting something like 7.4 µm. Can somebody explain??

    • http://www.flickr.com/photos/jan_f_rasmussen/sets/ Jan F. Rasmussen

      No, unless your are using DX size instead of FX in your calculation?

  • Ton

    From the Chipwork pictures I see a pixel pitch of ~14 microns, from a 16 MP full frame sensor I would expect a pixel pitch of 7.4 micron. Can somebody explain?

  • jhone

    mybe this is why the colors of the d800 are so bad… is it a bug mad by sony ?

  • http://louisdallaraphotography.com Louis Dallara

    I’ve worked as chip designer and when we contracted a foundry to do our fab they used our id , not the foundries on the wafer.

    This is smoke and mirrors.

    • JED

      Maybe you need to think a bit harder about the difference between ‘made’ and ‘fabricated’..

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