where there’s smoke there’s forum fire
I am not ignoring this thread, I am just thinking how to approach it. The problem is that if I post the rules, this won't stop any bad behavior. I don't want to be too restrictive either. I am not really sure what to do.
Adamz, if you think you have too much work monitoring everything, I can add another one or two moderators from different time zones.
As this forums grows (if it does) we will have more problems, so maybe we should just hide the URL and keep to ourselves?
The point of posting rules, any rules, is not to stop the bad behavior of those determined to be bad, but to create an atmosphere where the moderator actions are above reproach. (and to keep those with good intent in line)
A forum where the moderator actions are seen as arbitrary is a dead forum. A forum where favoritism is apparent is one where the signal to noise ratio falls somewhere short of pleasant.
Yes having moderators in different time zones will definitely help. That would be a good starting point, but the rules do have to be posted up first before the mods can enforce anything.
Those rules were pretty straight forward, common sense as well as common courtesy. If someone felt they were too restrictive, and could not abide by them, do we really want them as a member, and contributor to these forums?
I think it would be great to make this Forum grow larger, but like anything else it will not be without growing pains. That is why I started this post, because without rules this Forum could fall to pieces. More members can only make this Forum even more interesting and fun to be part of.
Pete
You know what? I always find thinking the same thing: I don't like to organize a mess, I just create a new one that is organized. That's what I did with my photo library.
So I'm here thinking should we start a new [NR] forum with these rules and such, and see how it goes? If all fails because of overpopulation then we "as in we who actually contribute" could easily hop back into our original, private [NR] forum. I think it's best if we start again, this time properly with our current experience, rather than try and reform everybody already in the current forum.
I know, it's a stupid and crazy idea, but that's how I think. Don't do it, if we mess up a second time we'll have to make a third [NR] forum ;^)
Oh, and by the way, what about admin's other two forums? We need to remember to pay attention to PR and LR too! Are these rules going to be universal?
Photorumors doesn't have a forum and the Leicarumors forum only gets a post every other month ;^)
I think I like your idea alpha. Let's call the new forum Little Rumors and make you the only member, lol I'm joking! I'm joking! It would be you AND connor :^)
But but but—I wanted to call it [NR] Jr.!
*Sob* Nobody loves me!
You didn't post anything here monty?
http://nikonrumors.com/forum/topic.php?id=632&page=8#post-11673
Copied from: http://nikonrumors.com/forum/topic.php?id=632&page=8
NikoDoby
I guess there should be a forum rule that says no comments of any kind in the photo a day thread, Pictures only? Or how about you MUST comment on the photo above yours! People always post here without saying a single thing about the photo directly above theirs.
Actually I never understood why I'm (well I feel like I am) the only one who post photos in other threads besides the PAD. This place should be filled with photos regardless of which thread there in.
monty11
No need to take it to the extremes Niko, but the text on this page doesn't really pertain to any picture.
As for always commenting on the photo in the previous post(s), then I don't always feel confident enough to post constructive criticism and I really don't like saying: "I don't know why, but I don't like your photo" or "for some reason the photo isn't working for me". I always try to comment when I really like something or I know what is bothering me. I don't think that making it compulsory to comment the picture above you will help anything, if I didn't have anything good or constructive to say, I would not post my next picture then
NikoDoby
No extremes monty its just people have been talking about forum rules lately and I was being serious about limiting this thread to photo's only since this has come up before. That way if nobody ever makes a comment about someone's picture they won't feel like everyone hates it.
Don't worry I'll put a picture in this thread too :^)
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I don't think that we should limit the thread to photos only but rather to photos and comments related to the photos. I think that there are sufficient people who comment on good and bad pictures. What I've often noticed is that average pictures don't really get commented, so basically it is not that people hate it, it is just that they don't love it :))
Sorry Niko, was distracted by some work calls :D
I kept calling your mobile but you never answered :^)
So what your saying is that if a photo is never commented on then it's just average? I don't think so because I've seen "below average" pictures get comments like crazy. Most of those comments are like "Where was this taken" or "What is that" things that usually lead to off topic post such as "I remember going there once..." or "I'd like to go there. Are there any good pubs around" etc. etc.
Every thread gets off topic ALWAYS. But that's just the nature of a forum in general. That's just the way people communicate with one another. No big deal. That's why I suggested making the PAD photos only. Most of the posters on the PAD are 90% the same group. I'd like to encourage more members to post things up but I think a lot don't because they don't think their work is good enough or they are actually seeking comments but then nobody ever says anything about their photo and so they never post again.
If we don't make the PAD pictures only then how about making it mandatory that you must comment on the photo above yours? If you can't find anything constructive to say about a photo other than it's boring, average, or "that picture should be burned immediately" then don't post your photo. Simple.
I think it's just rude when people always post their photos but never make a single comment on others except to say "your colors are all wrong".
What do you guys think because technically nobody is currently breaking ANY rules since there are no rules to break. So I have no right to tell another member to stop goofing off and get back on topic.
Admin - if You read my previous post about moderators please give them a try, also give us a little bit more tools - banning for a certain period of time would be good and the ability to move posts from one thread to another; btw: does anyone seen AquaCow - the second mod on this site?
as for PAD thread, I agree that it should be pictures only, or should I say, You post one picture You comment on two/three above - this would be fair I guess - no comments than Your posts gets deleted
Perhaps people here are just too polite and don't want to offend the author of the shot apart from some rude person who dared to utter the words "For me your red is oversaturated"?
I think that over the first several months we managed to keep the Photo-a-Day going on track nicely without any rules and no major derailments. I don't think that making comments about pictures compulsory is the way to go as it might dry up the PaD thread.
I think it's already kinda dry when it's the same 10 or so people posting. Not that I don't like what everyone's posting but I think we can all identify whose photo is whose even if you remove the names. Besides this is a rumors forum so if all you want to do is post your pictures you can do that in several different photo forums.
I really think we're asking this forum to be too many things at once :^( In order to have all the "features" we want the entire format has to "evolve" in order to better manage and be more user friendly. Doesn't the fact that this one thread has gotten the most responses ever in the history of this forum mean that people are not happy with the current format?
Or maybe we're all bored with our lives and have nothing better to complain about ;^)
Shoot if this is the only thing that keeps me up at night then I'm dying a happy man!
Niko: I don't think the thread got to be this long because we are not happy, I just think we are realizing that for NR to grow without going out of control certain structures have to be put in place
It most frustrating for Adamz, as the only active moderator, I agree 100% that more are needed, However even 10 moderators does not make a difference if they are without concrete rules to work with, fact is that there will always be entries from people that going to start a war or indirectly trying to sell something (link to a free D90 or something)
I know for my self this place is both a great place to learn about new things, and have a bit of online fun
Pete
I think it would be nice to have some guidelines to follow, but rigid rules will just lead to enforcement spats. I don't mind a little chat mixed in with pictures on PAD. Some of it leads back to "how did you take that shot?" or "what do you think of that lens?", which is helpful. If it gets out of hand, a gentle nudge from one of the old hands should be enough.
Mandatory critique of other photos will inhibit people from posting or lead to trivial comments. Blunt, direct comments are the most useful in terms of improving the photographer's skill (even if there's no way to rescue that particular picture). At the same time, "no comment" is just that--not a statement one way or the other. Most of the pictures are quite amazing, and I don't want to have to affirm that every time I post. I learn a lot just by lurking. Seeing through the eyes of the pros here is helping me move away from plain old tourist snaps.
About the PAD thread, ill take this point from life experience.
The world can be a cruel place, if you post a picture that might not be overly awesome, be prepared for constructive criticism, and take that with you, when you go out for your next shot - and your next shot will be even better, and so over time, this helps a lot.
Hell, when i started as an apprentice back in the day(even tho i say so its only 5 years ago), i thought i had the worst boss ever, he would be such an ass if i did something wrong or maybe broke something by accident.
But now when i look back at it, i think i might actually thank him, he helped me become who i am today, it takes a lot these days to throw me off the hook, and i think i can thank him being an ass for that, i am now prepared for anything anyone can throw at me, and still smile at the end of the day.
So my point is, if your new, or experienced, it does not matter, if someone has constructive criticism for your photo, take it with you, every time im out shooting i learn something new, and i like it that way.
about the Forum.
This forum i think is evolving nicely as it is, but i does need some rules that the moderators can hold the users to, also needs more mods.
That's just what i think anyway.
ok, thanks Adamz - I missed you first comment. NikoDoby, Gentoo and Monty11 are now also moderators - I will email them tonight with the news :)
Before I move over to the rules topic, I have a bigger dilemma: should we stay with the current forum software? It is free, simple, quick and stable but has some limitations that may or may not be fixed in the future. The best forum software out there is a vBulletin - think of it as a big monster that can do anything, but I can imagine it would be difficult and costly to maintain (in terms of server power, licencing fees, support). The biggest drawback of the current forum software is the lack of quotation of previous comments. Is it worth for that single feature to change everything? Another big issue will be migrating all current data to a new platform.
Maybe I should post a poll on this question: should we change the current software or replace with completely new one?
Not that i encourage people to give away money, but you could always set up a donation part, that closes once the monthly estimated server maintainence and licensing is reached.
if i werent so broke at the moment i would of offered to help, but i could only spare like 50 bucks hehe.
vBulletin i think might be a good upgrade.
Thank you admin for trusting me with the "keys" to the place.
I think a poll would be a great idea.
While I always love the new stuff, its not often that we get threads that are so large that we can't just use the old @admin system for reply. I wouldn't mind being able to see post-count and the such... but other than that, I'm not missing anything. I say Keep It Simple Stupid is the best approach.
Congradulations to our new moderators. As for the forum software, a few extra bells and whistles would be nice, but far from necessary. Truly it is the content, and the people that count, and the forum has that covered.
Yes but the more we grow the more things start to pile up. It's best to have things done properly from the beginning. It will make future upgrades easier.
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