bjrichus said:
We do need this in a separate thread, don't we?
a thread on Photoediting Computers
D400
(862 posts) (98 voices)-
Posted 9 months ago #
-
I am really interested to see what the D400 iso 3200 shots look like. I have my money ready for a D800E, however would enjoy the greater reach from a DX camera.
*forgetting DOF, my 200mm lens on my DX will fill the screen with what it takes a 300mm FF camera to do.
I need to see a BIG difference between the D400 and my D90, else it is likely a D800E in my future. I have lived with 4.5 (allegedly)fps on the D90, so dont really need 7+, though it would be nice. ;- )
I would take a peek at high iso on the D600 when it comes out as that would give me spare cash to add in a new lens.
Posted 9 months ago # -
I have run my mouth here so many times, I am repeating my self...almost. In the FPS, we used to shoot 4 and be happy as could be. But, once you can shoot ten or eleven FPS, and do it in bursts or even forty or fifty shots continuous.... it is easy to get spoiled. So, if the D400 does not shoot 8 FPS at full resolution, 10 max mode, and does not have at a minimum 6400 native ISO..that is almost noise free at 3200, it will not get my vote, and I will keep my D90 for back up. Or, if the sensor is the same as the D3200, that is what I might buy as a DX back up.
The nice thing about high FPS is that when shooting people, one can get the eyes wide open, where as with some folks they seem to blink often in front of the camera....but 6 or 8 frames quickly....catches the expression.
Now I have taken a liking to the idea of the Fujifilm X Pro-1 with ISO 6400 and 6 FPS, but in a small compact package with the 35mm f/1.4 lens. We will just have to wait until Photokina....or until the leaks reach the Admin on NR. Hopefully, Nikon will blow us away with the D400....
Posted 9 months ago # -
msmoto - I agree with you, plus we have to add a bullet proof body, weatherproofing and a great battery grip. The D400 needs to be a state-of-the-art DX format professional level piece of hardware. The question is whether or not it can be done for the necessary price point. The frame rate has to be pretty high which may mean that Nikon keeps the sensor resolution low in order to support a reasonably priced data pipeline. Could we see a comparable split in the DX line to what has occurred in the FX line? Might the D400 / D7200(?) be comparable to the D4 / D800? To my mind such a strategy makes sense.
So, if the D400 came out as a ruggedized, 8fps, 16mp, ISO 6400 camera with a large buffer, would it sell? or would the sensor res kill it?
...I keep looking at the X Pro-1 myself, then I begin to wonder about the Leica at which point I regain my senses and tell myself I should really shoot my P7000 a bit more before upgrading...
Posted 9 months ago # -
@Eric....I keep looking at the Leica glass for the X Pro !.....yikes.....easy to drop the price of a D800 into one lens.... But, Nikon may come through with a D400 which has been kept under extremely close security....18MP, ISO 12,800 native, 9 FPS, at a price of $1999 USD. I do not think the D400 and D600 will compete so much as the D400 will be the paparazzi camera, the D600 for the FX entry level. And the folks going to FX, well, the glass can get very pricey in a hurry....
We will see...
Posted 9 months ago # -
WHy do I check so often about a D400?? Many of the Nikon people I have talked to say THAT is the one they are looking for. And every once in a while someone gives up and does something else. The D600 size does not look appealing to me. And a D300s is not going to replace my D300 and D7000. I have used the D300s and it is a great DX camera, but you here all know that timing is everything. Nikon should have introduced the D400 before the Olympics as TaoTeJared said. I also completely agree with msmoto that the D600 will be an entry level FX camera. I am NOT sure that is how I would start in FX with a video capability. Owned the D700 but I found that video had become important to our work. . But file size is far more important than many in this thread maintain. I am using a Mac well above the 27 inch IMac. But I may even buy one of those for initial input and sorting out and start just putting selected images on my better rig. One huge driver in the D400 demand is the D7000 just plain has too many limitations.
Posted 9 months ago # -
Eric said:
...I keep looking at the X Pro-1 myself, then I begin to wonder about the Leica at which point I regain my senses and tell myself I should really shoot my P7000 a bit more before upgrading...I kept staring at the X Pro-1 at the local camera shop. Then I finally picked it up and fiddled with it a bit. It's a really, REALLY cool camera, but the controls are a bit daft and the manual focus on the X mount lenses is lame.
That said, it was a really tough decision between that or to get another D7000 to replace the one United airlines stole from me. I ended up with another D7000 cause I did not want to switch systems right before a month long Europe trip.
What will be the big challenge down the road for me (and I imagine others) is deciding D400, or maybe D600, or whatever the X Pro sequel is going to be. (X Pro-2?) Once the lens selection matures it will be a tempting option. The image quality is INSANE for a crop sensor camera. I think it's the best out there. I hope Nikon swings for the fences on the D400 - they need to.
Posted 9 months ago # -
-
Eric said:
So, if the D400 came out as a ruggedized, 8fps, 16mp, ISO 6400 camera with a large buffer, would it sell? or would the sensor res kill it?
For me it would kill it and I would move on to another camera. I would be happiest at 18-20 mp (yes i know 16-18 is almost nothing however ...)
Posted 9 months ago # -
D3X: 24mp, 5fps, ISO 1,600 FX
D3S: 12mp, 9fps, ISO 12,800 FX
D700: 12mp, 8fps*, ISO 6,400 FX *with battery grip
D4: 16mp, 10fps, ISO 12,800 FX
D800: 36mp, 4fps, ISO 6,400 FXD90: 12mp,4.5fps, ISO 3,200 DX
D300S: 12mp, 7fps, ISO 3,200 DX
D7000: 16mp, 6fps, ISO 6,400 DX
D5100: 16mp, 4fps, ISO 6,400 DX
D3200: 24mp, 4fps, ISO 6,400 DXOf course video, build quality, AF points etc all also differentiate the different models as well.
It seems to me that Nikon's priority for the D400 will be frame rate and build quality (in order to make a full professional DX body). If Nikon introduces a D400 with a greater pixel count than the D4, then Nikon's DX photojournalism body will have a greater resolution than their FX photojournalism body.
Looking at Nikon's lineup above, I can see a place for a high frame rate, high ISO, weatherproof body. Personally, I wouldn't mind a sacrifice (16mp) in sensor resolution to get that at a reasonable price.
Posted 9 months ago # -
I tend to agree/hope Eric is correct. The D400 if following "tradition" will be in the 16Mp range, ISO of possibly 12,800, and FPS of 8-9. But, if not, it will place some of us in a difficult position.
Of course, if Nikon comes out with an APS-C sensor in a mirrorless camera, like the Fujifilm X Pro-1, this may fill the need or desire for a pro level crop sensor camera body. The trick will be the development of an autofocus technology which can be used in an accurate continuous servo mode. But, once this technology is found, the end of the DSLR will not be too far behind. The ability to shoot 30-60 FPS at full resolution...mmmm. The perfect electronic viewfinder will eventually look as good as direct TTL viewing.
Oh me.... and an interesting note...the resolution is far less dependent on the megapixels than folks realize. A lot of very beautiful photos were taken with some D2's and D1's with 2.6 Mp....and 4.1 Mp......
Posted 9 months ago # -
msmoto, you hit on something I have been playing around with initially just for fun. I purchased a Sony A55, as there was no need for any features, except the digital 15x for focusing, to use on an ancient *1965/66* Nikon 500mm F5 mirror lens, with a TC200 Converter, attached to a Sony to Nikon Lens Converter. This rig has proven to be exceptional when mounted on a heavy duty transom to reduce shake while focusing. The combination is sharp as a tack.
The mirrorless camera takes stunning pictures on still subjects with the important advantage of being able to shoot faster without shutter vibration. It makes a significant difference in quality with on my long range bird shots.
I would love to see a superior mirrorless Nikon system with a high resolution viewfinder, like the higher end Sony, with a superb tracking system in it.
Here is a shot with this setup:
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/422269_479767672051671_1063800017_n.jpg
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/599369_479767962051642_1113720617_n.jpg
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/564498_479768495384922_1567536484_n.jpg
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/576144_479768202051618_1167466884_n.jpgThis is the same lens setup (it is sharp) on D5100 or D7000 with Shutter Locked UP:
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/538766_433538193341286_212320694_n.jpg
I am like everyone else that wants to upgrade the D300. Just waiting, mirrorless, or whatever, I still want a Nikon body that is significantly better than the D7000 for birding.
Posted 9 months ago # -
TriShooter said:
Here is a shot with this setup:
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/422269_479767672051671_1063800017_n.jpg
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/599369_479767962051642_1113720617_n.jpg
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/564498_479768495384922_1567536484_n.jpg
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/576144_479768202051618_1167466884_n.jpgMaaaaaaaybe it is my monitor. but what is wrong with the colors in the examples you show ? I wont comment on sharpness since they are small images. I would run away from this camera with those as examples.
Posted 9 months ago # -
msmoto said:
Oh me.... and an interesting note...the resolution is far less dependent on the megapixels than folks realize. A lot of very beautiful photos were taken with some D2's and D1's with 2.6 Mp....and 4.1 Mp......
If you shoot a D3s with a DX crop you are close to a D2hs which I have taken to 17x26 with no problem. I personally don't want more megs just to have more megs. I want fast & clean more than slow & dirty and more megs. I've been keeping my D2hs as a backup and I'm looking to upgrade it to a D400 or a used D3. I hope the D400 has no more than 16 megs and shoots fast and a real clean iso 3200.
framer
Posted 9 months ago # -
In support of framer's point. A good quality computer monitor has a dot pitch of about .25mm or 100 ppi. Assuming this level of detail is high enough for your print, then the native size of prints for different sensor sizes is:
(in inches to the nearest inch, 100ppi native res.)Sensor Image Image
Size width Height
6mp 30 20
10mp 39 26
12mp 42 28
16mp 50 33
18mp 52 35
24mp 60 40
36mp 73 49Software allows re-sizing of an image and printing at higher resolution (avoiding obvious pixelation), and even gets nice results at significant enlargements. As the chart shows a 6 fold increase in sensor pixels only results in a 2.4 fold increase in linear dimension of a print. So consider, a 16mp image printed out at 36 x 24 would have a native pixel pitch of about .19mm or 135 ppi. Also consider that a 1280 x 1024 monitor is displaying less than a 1.4mp image.
Many folks have never printed at 36 x 24 or above... How many MP do they really need? I really think that 16mp is a great number for the D400 sensor.
...I understand that more pixels allows for more cropping, but when cropping, lens limitations and focus errors can lead to frustration.
Going through this causes me to think that the best investment may often be better glass ... and somewhere in the background I hear msmoto whispering "Zeiss, zeiss, zeiss".
Posted 9 months ago # -
Eric said:
In support of framer's point. A good quality computer monitor has a dot pitch of about .25mm or 100 ppi. Assuming this level of detail is high enough for your print...Are you equating 100 ppi to actually printing at a density of 100 dpi??
If so, then you have some low standards for print quality. I would not go below 280 dpi for printing, and usually do 300 dpi.
Posted 9 months ago # -
Waiting for the D400 can lead to a lot of investigation of other possibilities....like the Fuji X Pro ! as noted. However, as time passes, reading more reports, the Fuji is a first generation camera which has some short comings I would find unacceptable, particularly in the manual focusing department. And, the D400 should be pretty good out of the box as it is, hopefully, a fully up to date pro DX camera with the latest sensor technology, better than any thing Nikon has in DX at present, possibly like the Fuji X Pro 1 which is the hallmark of the camera.
So, we wait, and most likely after the Coolpix announcement and possibly an APS-C "Coolpix" coming out....eventually, at Photokina, the D400 will be presented. If not....
Posted 9 months ago # -
msmoto said:
Waiting for the D400 can lead to a lot of investigation of other possibilities....like the Fuji X Pro ! as noted. However, as time passes, reading more reports, the Fuji is a first generation camera which has some short comings I would find unacceptable, particularly in the manual focusing department. And, the D400 should be pretty good out of the box as it is, hopefully, a fully up to date pro DX camera with the latest sensor technology, better than any thing Nikon has in DX at present, possibly like the Fuji X Pro 1 which is the hallmark of the camera.So, we wait, and most likely after the Coolpix announcement and possibly an APS-C "Coolpix" coming out....eventually, at Photokina, the D400 will be presented. If not....
So this year, we are getting a D4, D800, probably the D400, D600 and the possible APS-C EVIL, so ignoring the junk at the real low end of the Coolpoxes, five new cameras!
Hello ... Mister Visa, Amex, Mastercard ... are you there?
LOL!!!!!
Posted 9 months ago # -
From Ken Rockwell:
"I doubt either will try to lower the market for full-frame cameras. Full-frame is a luxury feature for which they charge a premium today, so it's far more likely we'll see pimped-out 1.6x and DX DSLRs than inexpensive full-frame DSLRs anytime soon.
I was in Tokyo catching up with friends, and previewing whatever may or may not get announced in two weeks when Japan traditionally announces all the hot new cameras for fall"
I don't think he was previewing a FX body in Tokyo as he wouldn't have made the statement about what he thinks is far more likely to show up, right? If he was able to preview a FX D600 then it makes no sense to say "we'll likely see a DX DSLR". So I'm guessing he got to preview a DX body. Another possibility would be an expensive FX body.. (>$2000).
OT: anyone noticed how much he loves his 5DIII and absolutely dislikes D800/D4? He seems to mention it every two posts or so...
Posted 9 months ago # -
D300 user said:
OT: anyone noticed how much he loves his 5DIII and absolutely dislikes D800/D4? He seems to mention it every two posts or so...
His site is good as a reference library for lens pics, and maybe some specs. If you try to follow his logic or opinions, it all falls apart. It's a stream of half baked contradictions.
I bet we are getting both the D400 and the D600 before Nov.
Posted 9 months ago # -
Both Ken and Thom seem to be suggesting new DSLRs will be out soon. Let's hope for both the D400 and the D600!
Posted 9 months ago # -
How long is everyone willing to wait if it isn't released next month?
Posted 9 months ago # -
I have no other option than to wait... Money to go FX is no problem but I really need DX for wildlife and birds. D7000 just isn't pro enough (fps, buffer, build quality). 8 fps, 18 MP, clean ISO's up to 1600 is what most of us want.
Posted 9 months ago # -
I am in no hurry. I'll wait to see what D400 vs D600 looks like (spec wise). Just leaves me more time to pick up a macro flash, maybe a new tripod, or some additional farkles for one of my bikes ....
Posted 9 months ago # -
I am not in a super rush, but I have been slightly annoyed lately with my D5000. Having to menu settings so much, I hit the buffer several times today, not wanting to crank the ISO up when I needed to. I was hoping to get some shots at the high school football games that will be starting soon, but I am not sure my D5000 will cut it (although I will give it a try anyway!).
There really is nothing else we can do but wait. No matter how great the D3200 sensor is it isn't a replacement for someone looking to upgrade. I hate to spend money on any of the current DX bodies knowing they are at the end of their production cycles...and unlike lenses the release of that new body will affect the prices.
Posted 9 months ago #
Reply »
You must log in to post.
