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help! does the d3k suck?

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mikeo21

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I need some advice:

I bought my first DSLR last January, a d60. I got it for about 480$. It was a good camera, but I heard that a new camera was coming out with better low light performance. I was able to surprisingly sell my d60 for more than I paid and I've been waiting for this mystery camera to come out since. Until today!

I was just told by somebody that the sensor is a CCD. Shit. Thats not the d5k/d90 sensor. The question is: is it the same as the old d60 sensor?

Well, I need to buy something. I preordered the d3000 (when I thought it was nikon new cmos sensor), but I'm sure I can still cancel.

Any advice on what I should do? I'm looking for something that does around what the d60 can do, although I would like low light performance to be better, this camera will be used for night shooting especially when I visit Japan next year. I was using my d60 mainly with my 35 1.8 prior to selling it.

Soooo.. any advice would be appreciated. I think I may have to wait until the d3k gets evaluated/compared first. Personally I'm wondering if I should find another d60 or better yet a cheap d40 and get a tripod.

Sincerely/Severely disapointed,

Mike.

Posted 3 years ago #
NikoDoby

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If your looking for a $500US CMOS camera, I say save up and get a D5000 or better yet a D90. Can't say much about the low light quality of the D3000 as it was only announced but it is the same 10MP CCD found on the D60. It's been supposedly tweaked to give better performance but by how much isn't yet known.

If low light performance is your only criteria then just save up for the D90.

here's a comparison chart of the D3000, D5000, and the D60. just scroll down a bit.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0907/09073004d3000handson.asp

Posted 3 years ago #
adamz

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cmos is a better option for low-light, as niko wrote save up and got either for d5000 or d90

Posted 3 years ago #
NSXType-R

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You know, I'm not too sure if it's as crappy as you expect it to be. It hasn't even come out yet. Yes, I know it's a CCD (some people prefer a CCD), but I'm sure it's been massaged by Nikon at least a little bit. And yes, it's at the bottom of Nikon's range, but a D40 does pretty well for what it is.

And in all seriousness, the D3000 looks way better than the freaking lumpy D5000 any day. :D

Besides, are you sure you want to replace your D40x with another D40 level camera?

Posted 3 years ago #
tai

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Unfortunately I've seen no hands-on impressions yet, but I imagine even though it's the same sensor as the D60 things have been tweaked so that high ISO performance is better. We saw this going from the D300 to D90 where the D90 is significantly better with the same sensor. That said, high ISO performance still won't be the same as the D90. But it does have a better AF system, at least. I probably wouldn't go for the D40, it's a downgrade from the D60 on everything except sync speed. Maybe you should look upwards to the D90?

Besides, while I love the high ISO performance, I hate having an ISO 200 minimum on CMOS cameras, it means I have to rely more on filters than I would otherwise. I'd love to be able to go all the way down to 10.

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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Thanks for the posts guys. After some thought I'm leaning towards trying to find a deal on a d5000. It has most of the performance of the d90 w/o the weight, something that is important to me for traveling. I also would hate to carry around something as expensive as the d90 just for fear of dropping it or having it stolen. Honestly I don't think I've "earned" the d90 from a photography standpoint, and I know I could have just as much fun for the next few years with a cheaper camera. When I graduate and start making money, thats when I'll go all out on the photography equipment :D

Unless I find a crazy deal on the d5k I will wait until the d3k is reviewed. After all, CCD isn't necessarily inferior to CMOS (I've read CMOS is actually recently a cheaper sensor to produce). We will see how bad(or good) this new entry level camera is.

thanks again, and I'll post here to let you guys know what I end up doing.

Posted 3 years ago #
NikoDoby

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Yeah don't buy too much into the whole CCD vs CMOS debate. They both have their strengths and weaknesses. Ultimately it's you, the photographer, who's responsible for a good or bad picture! If you can wait for the first reviews of the D3000 then you should. In the meantime start counting up your pennies :)

Thank you for asking and feel free to ask again moregan17. Wow, I'm starting to sound like those courtesy calls I'm always getting from my bank.

Posted 3 years ago #
shivaswrath

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the D3k has the same CCD as in the D40x/D60/D200. . . .the D5k has the better low-light handling 12.1 CMOS sensor, found in the D90/D300/D300s. . .they both have pluses and minuses, it really depends on what you are shooting and why?!

if I were to get myself a toy body to take on vacations, I would probably get the D5k or a revision of it in the near future, as all my lenses (thankfully) are AF-S (by randomness), it's smaller and easier to travel with than a D200, battery life is better than a D200, and the waiter taking a picture of me and the wife can use the live view easier, lol!

I think Scott Kelby was ranting and raving about his accidental D5k purchase recently:
http://www.scottkelby.com/blog/2009/archives/5172

Posted 3 years ago #
shivaswrath

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Just a quick note, the D5000k body only is now $659 on amazon, wtf?! Why not get that over the D3k, $50 difference!!

Posted 3 years ago #
Willis

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I'd take the D3000 over the D5000 (I think... need some test shots). I like the D5000's larger LCD. And smaller overall size. For low light, go grab a fast prime. The 35mm F1.8 prime at ISO 400 on a D3000 is way better than a kit zoom at ISO 1600 on a D90.

Either way, its definitely a upgrade from the D60. Nikon learns lots of subtle tricks as time progresses. This is why the D90 performs better in low light than the D300. And the D300s will probably be even better than both of them. Despite the fact that they have the same sensor.

Posted 3 years ago #
Willis

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Shiva, Isn't the D3K kitted?

Posted 3 years ago #
NSXType-R

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Willis, I think the D3000 has a bigger screen than the D5000. The D5000 has a 2.7 inch because it flips out and rotates. The D3000 I think has a 3 inch screen.

And yes, the D5000 is $659! Add to cart at Amazon!

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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Thanks for the tips. I was working on getting a d5k w/ kit lens for around that price locally. If that falls through I will probably jump on the amazon deal (that price is already "saved" in my cart.. w/ kit lens it is 760$).

My priority is low light performance, and I am already using the new 35 1.8 (refer to original post, lol).

What is the smartest option as far as the kit lens: Would it be smarter to buy the body only for 659 or w/ kit for 760? I guess my question is can one get a kit lens for <100$. I like the 35 1.8 but for a budget zoom I dont think there is a better candidate than the kit lens, so I need to get one either way.

Thanks,

Mike O.

Posted 3 years ago #
NikoDoby

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I say get the kit with the 18-55 VR lens. Your not going to find a VR lens for $100 bucks. Not even a used one so take advantage of the kit price. I think you'll enjoy the D5000 Mike. The video will be a big plus. Whether YOU use it or not. Having video will help when you sell it to upgrade. It'll give it more value.

Posted 3 years ago #
QuadraPixel

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CCD sensors are better for low light / high sensitivity work. CMOS consumes less power and can handle a continuous image (such as live view and video recording) with out smearing. Which is why camera manufactures use CMOS now.

Recent advances in CMOS technology has lead to better performance in low light compared to older CCD cameras like the D80 and D40x. However, when you take into account newer CCD tech; Nikon will likely have a better CCD sensor in the D3000.

Pixel density also has negative effect to you image, which is why the Canon 50D and T1i perform worse than the D300/D5000 in low light.

If I were a low light photographer looking for an entry level camera, then I would wait for the first reviews on the D3000 before purchasing one to see if Nikon stuck a better CCD sensor in it than it's older model.

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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hmm, i think I might have to wait until I see reviews of the 3000. If you are saying CCD has progressed significantly I think I owe it to myself to wait. I'm guessing dpreview etc will get their hands on one for a review before the camera is released to us right?

Also, anybody know about the d5k amazon pricing? I have it "saved" in my cart so I think that means I can still buy it at that price(at least for a while) right? I just dont wanna lose out on the d5000 price we are seeing right now, I'm not sure if its just the new market price, or if its temporary. After all, they did just recall quite a few, lol.

Posted 3 years ago #
NikoDoby

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Unfortunately Mike the Amazon price isn't valid until you actually buy it. The price in your cart isn't going to stay that way if amazon jacks up the price :(

Dpreview wont have a review of the D3000 until usually months after it becomes available. They only test production versions not "pre-release" cameras.

In all honesty I don't think the CCD from the D60 that is in the D3000 is going to be super miraculously better than the CMOS of the D5000,D90,D300S.

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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ya, after I posted that I was thinking it through. While the CCD sensor processing/tech may have improved.. I'm somehow not seeing it top the d5k/d90 quality.. I mean it is a cheaper body, period. Also as you said the d5k probably will have better resale due to the video capabilties. Hmmmmm.. .well sounds like I might be getting the d5k, a camera I made fun of upon its release, lol. I'll keep you guys posted.

Posted 3 years ago #
NSXType-R

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Beware if you're buying the D5000 because there was a massive recall lately of all the models. Check if the stock is fixed or if it is old stock.

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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So, I just pulled the trigger!
I bought a d5k kit for 750 from Tri State Camera. I got an additional 3 yrs of Nikon warranty for 69$, including two free cleanings. I think its worth it for the cleanings alone. The salesman told me he was confident the camera, coming from Nikon, would not be of the affected stock, but if it was I could send it right back to tri state camera and get another. He said I'll get it in 3 days by UPS... here goes!

Posted 3 years ago #
NikoDoby

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Great Mike!!! Keep us informed and don't forget to post in the Photo-A-Day thead.

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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well, received the camera and it is a bad one! wtf! I'll be sending it back to their sorry asses asap. the warranty they sold me was also bogus: mackcam.com warranty.. not a nikon warranty.... not very happy right now. it will take a few days to get this straightened out.

Posted 3 years ago #
NikoDoby

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So they sent you a grey market import? Sorry to hear Mike. Did you call them to get it straightened out?
Sounds like they sold you a two year extended warranty through mac, but it still has a Nikon USA 1 year warranty. Or No?

Edit: I see in their website it says a mack warranty is for an additional 3 years on top of Nikon's 1 year warranty. So it's 4 years of coverage. So this item shouldn't be an import, but what did they tell you Mike?

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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The camera they sent me was a US item, at least I think. I looked up the review for the warranty and they actually aren't bad(according to consumer reports). So I'm not too upset about that.

I just sent it back today. I put a note in that informed them if they send me another from the recall, I'll send it right back to them.

I had to pay the shipping back (bs). It was only 8 bucks but after I insured it for 850$ it cost me 23$ to ship. I have just sent an email to Tri-State asking for some compensation for this. Lets keep our fingers crossed. It arrives there tomorrow so lets hope I hear something soon.

Posted 3 years ago #
mikeo21

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WOW! So lame! So, I called them up today and the customer service agent wasn't aware of the recall and kept asking me about it and why I wouldn't want to just send it in to Nikon for repair. After all was said and done, he refunded me the money because he didn't have any in stock. So, I'm out 23$ and still dont have a camera.

Where can I buy a legit d5000? Amazon's price is good, whos inventory is back to normal?

Posted 3 years ago #

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