Fair price for used Nikon D3s? Or should I just wait for new FX-body in 2011?

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Fair price for used Nikon D3s? Or should I just wait for new FX-body in 2011?

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studio460

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A photographer I know is selling one of his Nikon D3s bodies for $3,700 USD. He purchased them new, shortly after their release. Forgot how many actuations--he mentioned 40,000, but he has a D3 and two D3s bodies, and I forgot which body he was talking about.

Anyways, not sure what to do . . .

You see, first, I have to blow $1,199 on a new D7000 so I can finally start making movies. That's why I originally bought my D90 (only to find that the D90 is virtually useless as a D-cinema camera without manual ISO and shutter speed control). Finally, Nikon decides to release the much-anticipated D90 "firmware upgrade," only it's a hardware upgrade, with the part number, "D7000." Why don't I just get the D3s and shoot video on that? The main reason . . . the D7000's superior AVCHD CODEC.

Anywho, since the D90 was useless for moviemaking, after sitting idle on my shelf for over a year, I recently started taking pictures with it instead. And of course, now, I love shooting stills again. I plan to shoot a new portfolio, which I'd like to shoot all-FX. I'm also soon going to have the opportunity to shoot some models for a commercial account, so it'd be real nice if I had an FX body for that, too.

But . . . everything tells me I should wait.

I'm not a professional still photographer (I shoot TV for a living), so I don't really "need" the D3s now. If I could just find a used D700 at a good price, I would probably just go with that for now. Or, the D7000 may be so improved (noise, low-light, etc.), I may be able to deal with that for a while. If I shell out $3,700 for a D3s now, and the "D4" comes out next spring (which will be here in no time), I won't be too happy. Plus, in addition to low-light photography, pixel count is also becoming an issue, since the portfolio prints will be quite large (I really need a D3x and a D3s!). Maybe I need to wait. But, Nikon seems to be on a four-year life cycle for their flagship bodies, so there may not be a "D4" announced until Photokina 2011 . . .

Posted 2 years ago #
Vall

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Honestly, get the Panasonic GH1/GH2 for video. I reckon it'll be a far better choice than D7k. Or (sad to say this really) go Canon with 7d.

Posted 2 years ago #
studio460

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Vall said:
Honestly, get the Panasonic GH1/GH2 for video. I reckon it'll be a far better choice than D7k. Or (sad to say this really) go Canon with 7d.

I can't see how the GH1 is a "far better choice" than a D7000--the D7000's DX-sized imager is larger than the GH1's Micro-4/3rds imager. That difference alone, is enough to make it the "winner."

Also, I've already acquired thousands of dollars' worth of fast, manual-focus Nikkors, specifically for moviemaking. Can't, and don't want to switch to Canon. Have far too much invested in Nikon glass. For those considering the GH1 (or any D-SLR) specifically for filmmaking, I would recommend the Sony VG10 over the GH1. It has a better form factor than a 7D, and a larger imager than a GH1.

Back on-topic . . . so what does everyone think? Is $3,700 a good price for a good-condition D3s? Or should I just wait for another D700 refurb deal? Or, wait for a 'D4" and "get by" with the D7000?

Posted 2 years ago #
adamz

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AFAIK next Photokina will be in 2012 - it's in a 2 year cycle. as for d4, I would expect one around August/September 2011, as it's on four year cycle. so basically IMHO, I wouldn't go for the d3s if You gonna get the d7000 and have d90 right now. as for portfolio, if You don't print Your portfolio bigger than A3 (which I doubt, as A2 is simply to big to carry around), than d90 resolution is fine (not to mention that per pixel resolution is same as from d3x). so basically get new lens instead - i.e. 200/2 vr
if You really have a lot of manual glass, than it's really not a problem which camera body You use - just get a proper adapter, and I'm going to agree with Vall that Panasonic will be a better option for video - as You only need Full HD. although, if You wanna stick to Nikon, than at this point of time d7000 will be a better option, due to codecs it has (as You wrote before).

Posted 2 years ago #
ddg

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Yea I don’t expect the D4 until Christmas 2011 or later. I would expect to see a D300 upgrade and a D700 upgrade first. I personally am going to wait until the D4 is released. I did not want to buy a camera and put it on a shelf because it can’t do what I want it to do, and then turn around and have to buy another camera to achieve what I originally want to accomplish. It is the same of just going out and buying a video camera because I need good textures too that come from stills. I would much rather just wait until I had an all in one package. I am sure if you are making your living on video you have the means of producing your spots, but I am just going to rock along until I see something that can do what I need it to do then I will buy. I hate wasting money.

Posted 2 years ago #
kanuck

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Thats a fair amount of actuations so its definately broken in. Its rated at 300,000 I believe. My D700 had 35,000 shots on it so the price dropped all the way down to $2100 back at Christmas 2009, which made it great deal back then. $3700 for the D3s is a good deal I think. I'd bite on it I think because with Nikon you might be waiting a long time into 2011 for the next FX body. When it does come out though its going to be really something I bet.

Posted 2 years ago #
Mike Gunter

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Hi Studio460,

Here's my recommendation.

My guess is that Nikon won't come up with a terrific video option for a while. I think it will get there, the D7K footage has been promising, but I'm just not optimistic that it will happen soon.

If that is true, I'd do what Adamz suggests and get a Canon body with a Novofex adapter for your lenses. You will want to run everything in manual anyway, to include focus and aperture, so really, that shouldn't be a hang up.

You'd get terrific DOF, be able to use your lenses, and create your print portfolio using the D90, if you wish, tie up your movie assets in Canon body + adapter + _accoutrement_ as you see necessary for movie making.

It would likely be the less heinous of expenses of getting into making good looking movies with what you already have.

BTW, ounce for ounce, the Panasonic GH1 is the best hybrid camera of the lot. If you check out Vimeo and YouTube you'll be surprised at the quality of movies some guys are able to achieve with the little camera - especially considering that it is a fraction of the cost of it's competitors.

One more thing, and something that is rarely mentioned in DSLR movie making, better results are obtained with prime lenses. Unless your story calls for a lot of radical changes of POV, you should be able to get by with 3 or 4 lenses.

Hope this helps and my best,

Mike

Posted 2 years ago #
smarterchild

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i just have to say that is a amazing price for a D3s. If you dont buy it then id sell my D3 for that.

Posted 2 years ago #
Vall

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studio460 said:
I can't see how the GH1 is a "far better choice" than a D7000--the D7000's DX-sized imager is larger than the GH1's Micro-4/3rds imager. That difference alone, is enough to make it the "winner."

I meant for video only purposes. Just check the samples avalible online. The quality of videos on Panasonic end is really great for the price. I was amazed myself. Stills will be better with D7k tho, no doubt about that.

As for the D3s. If you need it, then take it. It's a good price, and an amazing camera. Plus, the full frame will make your videos even more ciema-like.

On the other hand, if you already have some Nikon lenses, then I suppose it's already decided. :)

Posted 2 years ago #
studio460

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Thanks for everyone's responses! Really appreciate everyone's thoughts! Adamz--helpful post! DDG, Kanuck . . . yeah, I don't think the "D4" is due anytime soon either. But if it's due out any sooner than Q4 2011, I would be hesitant to buy the D3s now.

I talked to a Nikon rep recently about plans for new FX bodies, and he said, "Look at Nikon's current product life cycles, and go from there . . . " He definitely agreed with the credo, "No new FX bodies for 2010."

He also said that Nikon engineers are under the gun to compete with the Canon 5d MkII, and are working "under a lot of pressure" to bring the line up to parity with Canon's (i.e., 1080p24). So, I think it's still possible that Nikon could surprise everyone by announcing a new 1080p24 FX body, earlier than anticipated. If so, I'm thinking possibly summer to fall, 2011, just like Adamz' prediction.

Just to clarify, the D3s purchase would be strictly for stills. I am definitely buying a D7000, and will be using it almost exclusively for filmmaking applications. Vall, I know the GH1 is a great filmmaking camera for the price, but I think the larger imager size of the D7000, and the native F-mount of the D7000 gives it the edge.

Posted 2 years ago #
Vall

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The most important one will be the one you feel best with shooting video/stills. :)
So go with whatever feels best for you.

As for waiting. I've waited 3 years for my DSLR (did not have enough cash for D90, and when I had it was already Jan 2010, so I decided to wait). From one point of view it was really worth it, I can buy a better camera now. But on the other hand I lost 3 years of possible photographs. Even with an entry level. Just translate it to your situation. :)

Good luck and happy filming. :)

Posted 2 years ago #
jonnyapple

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If there's no rush on this guy's D3s, why don't you wait to see if the D7000 is enough camera for the stills you want? Print a few at the sizes you're going for (really big, if I remember what you've said before right) and see if you need a separate dedicated stills camera. The D7000 has a lot of the same features for the kind of lenses I'll bet you bought for cinema—specifically, metering with AI-S lenses and a rangefinder option for manual-focus lenses.

Posted 2 years ago #
kanuck

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Smarterchild great idea! You should hurry up and do that actually while you can still get a good price for your D3. What a trade up that would be. I wouldn't be surprised if you still had to throw in about $500-$700 cash at least still though. The D3s is probably Nikon's best camera now.

Posted 2 years ago #
smarterchild

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I'd love to if the opportunity comes to me but at this moment.. I have a great setup and broke ATM hahah. It'd be worth it tho. Amazing price.. D3 would go for that price let alone d3s is about 4700 used

Posted 2 years ago #
shivaswrath

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Id wait....get the d7k for sure to suit your video needs, but the d3s is priced too close to either the d4 or a revised d700 type body with video for you to justify...
I just bought a used d3 after using a d90 for a short stint...couldn't be happier, but I got it nearly a d7k less than the proposed used d3s price....

Posted 2 years ago #
studio460

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shivaswrath said:
Id wait....get the d7k for sure to suit your video needs, but the d3s is priced too close to either the d4 or a revised d700 type body with video for you to justify...

Thank you for that sober advice . . .

Yes, I agree that it's just too high a price, compared to what may be introduced next summer/fall in a "new" D700 release. The big question for me is if Nikon would announce a D700 replacement before they announced a new "D4." A new D700, with a higher pixel-count than the current D3s, doesn't seem like something that would promote D3s sales very well. Yes, I know it's not all about pixel-counts, but if I were the Nikon product line manager, that's not something I would be very eager to do marketing-wise.

shivaswrath said:
I just bought a used d3 after using a d90 for a short stint...couldn't be happier, but I got it nearly a d7k less than the proposed used d3s price....

Yes, the $3,700 offer, while interesting, isn't the whopping discount that would've made me jump on the purchase, hence the title of this thread, and the cold feet.

Posted 2 years ago #
shivaswrath

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studio460 said:
Thank you for that sober advice . . .

Yes, I agree that it's just too high a price, compared to what may be introduced next summer/fall in a "new" D700 release. The big question for me is if Nikon would announce a D700 replacement before they announced a new "D4." A new D700, with a higher pixel-count than the current D3s, doesn't seem like something that would promote D3s sales very well. Yes, I know it's not all about pixel-counts, but if I were the Nikon product line manager, that's not something I would be very eager to do marketing-wise.

Yes, the $3,700 offer, while interesting, isn't the whopping discount that would've made me jump on the purchase, hence the title of this thread, and the cold feet.

I think Nikon might just update the D700 before the D3s. . .before the D7000, I wasn't so sure, but apparently they are okay releasing bodies to address Canon competitors: clearly the D7k is aimed at the 7D/60D segment. I would imagine a 1080p video D700 with a D3s sensor will be squarely aimed at the Mark 2; would be SICK if they step it up a notch and release the D3x sensor+video in that body, I would sell for that in a heart beat!

Posted 2 years ago #

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Fair price for used Nikon D3s? Or should I just wait for new FX-body in 2011?

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