Thanks a lot for posting these, Gareth. I'm curious: did you use in-camera processing for the JPEGs from both cameras? The X100 seems to handle noise well throughout the ISO range, but the JPEGs from it look consistently a bit underexposed compared to the shots from the D700.
FujiFilm X100 Discussion
(97 posts) (25 voices)-
Posted 2 years ago #
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Gareth can you post the pictures instead of putting a link to download them? I got a PM from a forum member saying they got a malware alert when they tried to download your pics. Not saying there is a problem with your link but rather be safe then sorry.
Gareth said:
it is not for preschoolers to use. it is for the teachers to use taking picutres of the preschoolers. this is basically what I do, take natural photos of children, and I don't think the camera is excessive. it was the only camera I felt certain they would be able to get great photos with.No other camera is capable? I was an educator for many years too and I would much rather spend $1200 dollars on more then one point & shoot camera for teachers to use. As much as I like the X100, I think two D3100 would serve teachers better. Especially with the faster auto focus to follow those fast moving pre-schoolers around. I would have a very hard time justifying a $1200 purchase for one point & shoot camera for my students.
But anyway... I don't see the X100 image quality beating out a newer DSLR or the "older" D700.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Geez Niko you really hate the idea of this odd thing with only one focal length. ;)
From what I have seen, image quality rivals the D700 in some high iso circumstances. I have seen many 100% crops and IMO it holds it own against every camera up to 3200. Throw it into B&W and 6400 even has a great film look.
The X100 is geared towards a "stylistic function" and is not for everyone. Even Fuji has said it has been really surprised by the response to the camera. If you see the single focal length and think "WTF", instead of getting excited, then this is certainty not a camera for you.
Just a thought: Even an Oly Ep-2 with flash, 17mm 2.8, and 20mm 1.7 almost $1200 now ($1500 first release) I didn't hear many bulking at that price. Hell, even one D3100 with a 18-55vr and 55-200Vr lists at $1200. One thing is for sure, X100 blows all the m4/3rds cameras away.
For me I think I can see taking this and my D300 with my 85mm 1.8 on many walk-abouts.
Posted 2 years ago # -
I put those on megaupload as they are packed in a 350Mb zip file. it is not malware. others have opened them without issues. the zip also contains a txt file that says what the camera settings were.
as for point and shoots. we have three. they take horrible pictures. there are of course other cameras but the reason I went for the x100 rather than a dslr, is that it can fit in a teachers apron pocket (a major point in it being used), and the setting can pretty much be left on f/2 1/125 all of the time when inside. i know what you mean about AF speed, and it is wayyyyy slower than my dslrs. but it IS easier to use and it DOES take great picture.
The pictures out of the camera have less pop than my d300s, but much less noise, and the camera takes up less space. so i suppose it depends on whether the shoe fits.
your not gonna go out and take bird or soccer pictures with the x100 though.
atm you can only use the bundled software to edit RAWs. it is a fuji silkypix ap and I REALLY don't like it. it can't develope NEF so can't compare to d700 files, but these should give you a clue.
click through to my photobucket page to download in full size.
X100 f4 ISO1600 JPG
X100 f4 ISO1600 JPG from RAW
X100 f2 ISO1600 JPG
X100 f2 ISO1600 JPG from RAW
X100 f/2 ISO1250 JPG
X100 f/2 ISO1250 JPG from RAW
X100 f/8 ISO500 JPG, tripod
X100 f/8 ISO500 JPG from RAW, tripod
X100 f/4 ISO 400 JPG, handheld
X100 f/4 ISO 400 JPG from RAW, handheldPosted 2 years ago # -
Why is there such a huge difference in exposure between RAW and JPEG? I hate using SilkyPix too. Those of you who always complain about Nikon's software should be forced to use SilkyPix instead ;^)
Posted 2 years ago # -
the jpegs are out of camera. the RAWs were edited in order to show what could be achieved over the out of camera jpegs.
The d700 files are far superior in terms of detail and i didn't even shoot in 14-bit which I almost always do.
after a few days of shooting it my final conclusions are.
1. for the most part it's very easy to use.
2. it's small and nicely balanced, unlike a NEX
3. image quality in terms of pop, in jpeg standard settings is slightly better than EP-1
4. high ISO performance is very usable, 1600 no trouble, 3200 if you want to.
4. adjusting most settings is one click.
5. it works nicely with my sb-700 in manual mode on a sc-29. the camera has a commander option, setting this and the sb-700 to commander does NOT enable triggering remotes.
6. the auto ISO works well, but is buried on page 3 of the settings menu.
7. the auto focus is slow compared to dslrs, i hope they update this in firmware like the PENs did.
8. the write speeds are very slow. even jpeg fine takes a while. I bought an extreme pro card and it only made a little difference over a class 4 card. i hope this gets a firmware update too. the buffer does however hold 10 jpeg or 9 RAW. you can keep shooting while the previous burst is processing up to the buffer full point.
9. you get software. i suggest cancelling the first fuji ap (when it asks for language) and then installing only the RAF helper (installs after first ap) and silkypix until lightroom etc. do an update.
10. not cheap, and realistically, for most people, not worth 2 PENs or even a NEX and a PEN. extremely niche market at this price. it will need to drop down to $700-800 pretty fast to stay in the game.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Your Jpegs are very underexposed regardless of you fixing the RAW files. Something is not right with your samples (or camera?).
Posted 2 years ago # -
i was trying to keep the shutter speed the same as the D700 for comparison purposes. all the shots are underexposed on both cameras, but according to the D700 in 3D metering that is the correct exposure. both cameras had issues with correct meteringin the conditions, but I would have done test shots if it was a proper photo.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Yeah, your review really shows how much of a niche Fuji is exploiting. They'll probably get a whole bunch of sales now because people may not want to pay Leica prices for a Leica-esque experience.
By the way, you seem to be in Japan?
Posted 2 years ago # -
yes. i'm in osaka until the 1st of april. i have been living here for 2 year and a bit. when i get back to new zealand i will have to try a lot harder to test things. it is pretty easy to get what you want here.
Posted 2 years ago # -
@Gareth - I had a couple of questions if you don't mind.
How well does the AWB work?
Can you set a custom WB?
How well can you work with the jpg in photoshop/lightroom? Do they hold up well?Thank you for sharing!
Posted 2 years ago # -
My friend at work (another cameraguy) really likes these and wants to buy one. I told him he could buy a full-featured D3100 DSLR instead, but he likes the form factor. Why doesn't Nikon make something like this? They'd probably sell a million of 'em to Nikon enthusiasts like us.
He's also about to buy his first DSLR (he wants the Fuji and a DSLR). But he keeps looking at Canons (he even rented a 7D one weekend). I keep "suggesting" Nikon.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Nikon execs were quoted 2 years ago that they thought the mirror-less cameras were a fad and there was no market for them. Nikon has always been on the cutting edge of DSLRs but behind in everything else.
Honestly I think the big three, Nikon, Canon, & Sony (to a lesser point) are fine letting the others dominate in the mirror-less arena knowing they have beat them out of the DSLR market. And really, I think Panasonic, Olympus, & Samsung are glad to be working in a cheaper market and found a niche. Fuji on the other hand seems to be walking in circles in right field - makes a great play every once in a while but keeps everyone wondering what they are doing the rest of the time.
I wouldn't do the Fuji as a primary camera for sure and I think most average users would be very disappointed in it. If I didn't have my D300 and all my 2.8's, I would not be looking at this at all.
Posted 2 years ago # -
TaoTeJared said:
I wouldn't do the Fuji as a primary camera for sure and I think most average users would be very disappointed in it. If I didn't have my D300 and all my 2.8's, I would not be looking at this at all.Perhaps not as a primary camera, but as my friend suggested, a perfect "street" camera, in that it's small, inconspicuous, and quiet (I don't know if the Fuji is quiet, but that's one feature which garnered many fans of rangefinders in the past). I would love a small, but high quality, Leica-ish, rangefinder-ey, pocketable camera for just such shots myself.
Posted 2 years ago # -
TaoTeJared said:
@Gareth - I had a couple of questions if you don't mind.How well does the AWB work?
Can you set a custom WB?
How well can you work with the jpg in photoshop/lightroom? Do they hold up well?Thank you for sharing!
yes the auto WB works well, but not that well, but neither does the WB on my slrs indoors and in mixed lighting. the best way to adjust other than post is to set live view and chimp the scene. with the EVF/screen this is easy and uses far less battery power than live view.
yes there is custom WB. there is also kelvin and 3 flourescent settings which cover a good range. silky pix actually has a huge amount of raw flourescent presets which I thought was about the only good thing about the program.
i must have turned off the import jpegs function in lightroom and can't seem to turn it back on to import the jpegs from the x100.
download the file from megaupload and have a play if you want to open them. I just had a quick play in CS4 and they stack up well. the building shots at ISO6400 have far less detail than the d700 shots, but hey, what do you expect.
this camera is a little slow in AF for fast paced "street" scenes, however, if you take the time to set up the shot a little or MF it should be fine.
i think it will suit people who just don't want to lug the slr everywhere and look like a turbo dad (or mum). other parents eyes bulge when I get out the d700 with 35 1.4G and a sb-700 on a sc-29 with a snoot or the 300 2.8, just to take pics of the kids at the park. lol. this would be alot more subtle (but i wont be buying one for myself).
Posted 2 years ago # -
Gareth said:
yes. i'm in osaka until the 1st of april. i have been living here for 2 year and a bit. when i get back to new zealand i will have to try a lot harder to test things. it is pretty easy to get what you want here.That's really cool, I'd like to live in Japan for a while.
studio460 said:
My friend at work (another cameraguy) really likes these and wants to buy one. I told him he could buy a full-featured D3100 DSLR instead, but he likes the form factor. Why doesn't Nikon make something like this? They'd probably sell a million of 'em to Nikon enthusiasts like us.He's also about to buy his first DSLR (he wants the Fuji and a DSLR). But he keeps looking at Canons (he even rented a 7D one weekend). I keep "suggesting" Nikon.
Nikon could call it a SP and sell it for $1500, I'm sure they'd make lots of money on it.
They can also stick the old Nikon font on it too, make it look really retro.
As Thom Hogan said, the Nikon DSLR department and the Coolpix department seem to be completely different in terms of philosophy. I would imagine the R and D departments are different too, which would mean they might be resistant to changing to mirrorless.
Posted 2 years ago # -
As much as I like the X100 form factor, I don't think it is a great camera. It looks like a rangefinder, but it is NOT. It has a fast lens and a DSLR sensor but it handles and acts like a point & shoot camera. And the price is just too high. Yes it is cheaper than the Leica X1 and yes it has some interesting new technology but I still think it's too expensive for a point & shoot. I'd rather spend the money on a D7000 or on the Panasonic GF1. There are going to be a lot of compact "pro" looking cameras coming along that will make the X100 look even more over priced.
Posted 2 years ago # -
I'm willing to bet we'll see a price drop ($100-150) once the initial rush to buy the X100 is over, but NikoDoby is right, way overpriced for what it is.
Posted 2 years ago # -
NikoDoby said:
As much as I like the X100 form factor, I don't think it is a great camera. It looks like a rangefinder, but it is NOT. It has a fast lens and a DSLR sensor but it handles and acts like a point & shoot camera. And the price is just too high. Yes it is cheaper than the Leica X1 and yes it has some interesting new technology but I still think it's too expensive for a point & shoot. I'd rather spend the money on a D7000 or on the Panasonic GF1. There are going to be a lot of compact "pro" looking cameras coming along that will make the X100 look even more over priced.it handles and acts like a point and shoot camera. well i suppose it kind of does. but it would seem that your don't give a crap about image quality as you haven't mentioned it. the image quality of the X100 is FARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR superior to any point and shoot. i would also say it is superior to PEN and NEX, both of which my workmates have, so I have used.
it is not an slr or a rangefinder and therefore it sucks? i consider your reasoning flawed.
the X100 is a small camera with GREAT image quality, and is very easy to use.
is it over priced? yes. i said that already as point 10 of one of my previous posts. i think it will need to drop to within $200 of a PEN or NEX with lens in order to compete, because they are it's competitors, not slrs and rangefinders.
Posted 2 years ago # -
NikoDoby said:
As much as I like the X100 form factor, I don't think it is a great camera. It looks like a rangefinder, but it is NOT. It has a fast lens and a DSLR sensor but it handles and acts like a point & shoot camera. And the price is just too high. Yes it is cheaper than the Leica X1 and yes it has some interesting new technology but I still think it's too expensive for a point & shoot. I'd rather spend the money on a D7000 or on the Panasonic GF1. There are going to be a lot of compact "pro" looking cameras coming along that will make the X100 look even more over priced.I know it's a niche camera and it's also not a rangefinder, but damn it's a nice concept. And most definitely it won't be a primary camera for many people. But for those who like the old school look and feel without jumping to Leica prices, the Fuji is a great alternative.
And yes, I too would get a GF1 well before getting a Fuji, but I would certainly get the Fuji if I had the disposable income.
Posted 2 years ago # -
just like an slr you cannot adjust many settings after going into movie mode. you must focus manually (or automatically and "lock" into manual, or hold AFL) and then go into the drive menu and select movie.
if you select AF-S in shooting mode movie mode is still AF-C.
Posted 2 years ago # -
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SkintBrit said:
Kai has posted a video review on the DigitalRev TV site if anyone is interested.Be careful what you wish for!
It feels like I watch Digital Rev not because I like Kai presenting, I watch it because I feel as if there are no other ways to get camera reviews that are so up to date.
I actually like the video shot with Canon cameras a lot and the way Hong Kong looks. I miss that city more than anything else.
But yeah, maybe not now for Japan.
Posted 2 years ago # -
I've never been to Hong Kong, but their videos certainly give me the urge to check it out. Maybe they should do a "tour guide" video? :-)
Posted 2 years ago # -
Am I the only one who thinks Kai from Digital Rev is pretty funny? Slightly idiotic at times, but funny. I guess I've got a pretty dry sense of humor, but he usually gets me chuckling. I'll have to go check out his X100 review.
Posted 2 years ago #
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