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D700 annoying noise pattern

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ns1337

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So today I decided to shoot some test pics at the max ISO for the D700, that's 25,600. Anyway, I was surprised to see some very noticeable and annoying noise patterns, especially on solid color backgrounds. I've been scouring the web trying to find other examples of this noise patterns and I couldn't find anything. All 25,600 photos of the D700/D3 I could find are devoid of this pattern I'm experiencing. Maybe someone here has ever seen this, or can reproduce the issue? I just want to make sure I didn't get a crappy sensor. Here is my sample:

http://g3.img-dpreview.com/7401A10C1A6649EAACBCD133F9FD7F43.jpg

Thanks

Posted 2 years ago #
bmxdad

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My first respond to your concern is: WHY

but anyway your D700 is simply not able to record a lot of great info at max ISO, this is what DpReview had to say:

"Unsurprisingly the D700's performance in this test is very similar to what we saw in the D3 review a few months ago. This means you still get perfectly usable results at ISO 6400 and while due to Nikon's light-handed approach to luminance noise reduction you get some graininess at the highest ISO settings the results still look surprisingly sharp and detailed. Only the maximum ISO setting (25600, something that was unheard of only a year ago) should pretty much be reserved for emergency use only."

If you want something at that ISO the only game in town is the D3s

Pete

Posted 2 years ago #
studio460

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"Fixed-pattern noise" results when CCD and CMOS sensors are used at high-gain (i.e., very high ISOs). It's ugly and doesn't "change."

Posted 2 years ago #
ns1337

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I hear you both, BUT: In all web samples I found there was no such "banding" pattern. Sure it had lots of noise, but nothing like these red bands. Here is a simple test: take a shot with your lens cap on, at ISO 25,600. Please post the pic and we'll see if you have this pattern or not. I do.

Posted 2 years ago #
solid_liq

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Why don't you take a picture like that, and use it as a dark frame to subtract to see if that helps with the banding pattern if you're so worried about it?

Posted 2 years ago #
jonnyapple

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I like s_l's idea ( http://nikonrumors.com/forum/topic.php?id=1903#post-32151 ). Or Pete's to use the D3s if you need higher ISO than 6400.

Have you tried noise reduction in Lightroom 3 or noise ninja?

Pete, haven't seen you around much lately. I guess you're out enjoying the weather. (finally)

Posted 2 years ago #
ns1337

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OK, all I'm asking is that someone takes that shot with the lens cap on and tells me if this noise pattern is apparent (post photo if possible). This is not a question about whether I'm crazy, or whether I should buy a D3s. It's about the D700 noise pattern at ISO 25,600.

Posted 2 years ago #
bmxdad

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jonnyapple said:
I like s_l's idea ( http://nikonrumors.com/forum/topic.php?id=1903#post-32151 ). Or Pete's to use the D3s if you need higher ISO than 6400.

Have you tried noise reduction in Lightroom 3 or noise ninja?

Pete, haven't seen you around much lately. I guess you're out enjoying the weather. (finally)

Yes the weather have finally been getting better, but further south in Alberta they have not been so lucky with the weather, with lots of flooding from 6 plus inches of rain in a few days, our mayor hwy # 1 was actual washed out and still closed

Back to your high ISO problem, do you have a problem at regular high ISO of 6400, that is really the max ISO for the D700

Pete

Posted 2 years ago #
heartyfisher

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Banding is usually caused by bright lights in the picture.. it seems to go right across the sensor horizontally from the source area of the bright light.

Posted 2 years ago #
ns1337

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The banding occurs even when the cap is on, so not a light source related thing. At 6,400 in some instances I do get this pattern (not as strong of course, but still). I'm just wondering if I got a defective sensor with a gain problem or something like that, as I've been unable to find banding in high ISO samples of the D700 I've found on the web.

Maybe somebody here can take a couple shots and post them? Thanks.

Posted 2 years ago #
Rusty1963

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I have a D700 and I'm very happy with it. I have not yet had a situation where I have needed more than ISO 6400. That is not to say that there may not be in the future.

Using the dark frame is also a very good way to minimise this issue.

Using the highest ISO, is like turning your Hi-Fi up all the way, there is bound to be distortion, and of course, nobody has suggested that you are crazy.

>"Back to your high ISO problem, do you have a problem at regular high ISO of 6400, that is really the max ISO for the D700?"<

The fact that this pattern shows up when you are set to ISO 6400 may indicate an issue. If you are really concerned, take your camera to Nikon and have them check it out for you.

I took a picture at highest ISO with the lens cap on, and got quite a bit of reddish noise. Most of which went away at about 80% noise reduction in Lightroom 3. What I was left with, was a band of red/maroon at the bottom of my frame stretching about 10% the way up the picture.

I exported the file and I am unable to see any noise in the final product. For some reason, I have been unable to upload either of these pictures.

Posted 2 years ago #
Achrntatrps

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I have been using intensively a D700 for low light purposes since its release(especially concerts, theater and stars) and I think your picture is something normal for my experience. However, it's difficult to ditinguish a real problem on a such small pic.
I regularly have situations where I have to shoot in between 5000 and Hi1 ISO, and when shooting at such extreme settings, it's mostly in B&W. If you don't need ultra high resolution for your pics (I mean, if the goal is to upload them on the internet), D700 does the perfect job.
Banding appears on some camera I tested around their maximal sensitivity level (Canon 5D mkII or G9 for example)and can sometimes be very strong, especially when pixels are saturated (moon, bright stars, lights): older cameras didn't show so much this behaviour, because a device called "drain" was included between the photosites. But it seems to me that lowlight sensitivity (via larger photosites)has since been favoured over drains, which take some space on the sensor's surface... I took these infos from the book of Thierry Legault, "Astrophotographie" (http://legault.perso.sfr.fr/index.html), which is my reference. I hope I remember correctly...

Alex

Posted 2 years ago #
kanuck

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Forget any camera shooting at ISO 25,600 except the D3s because no amount or photoshop or noise ninja will be able to correct the noise at that level. Like Pete said, 6400 is usually the abosolute max you can push the D700. Before being worried about any sensor I'd run tests at 6400 and see how the noise is there. I've had my D700 for 6 months now and have only shot 6400 once, usually try keeping the iso to 1600-3200 and its fine.

Posted 2 years ago #
beggerx

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Don't worry, I get the exact same pattern
This is one of the one few things I noticed when I bought this camera, I tested another D700 in Japan 4 months ago, and it had the same pattern

Posted 2 years ago #
IndyGeoff

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Is this like those 24-70 users taking 10 min exposures with the lens cap on to see a light leak ? ;- ) .... Just having some fun with you OP. I do not have a D700, hopefully someone that does will post an image for you to look over.

Posted 2 years ago #
JorPet

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Will post mine tomorrow when my ExpressBus CF reader gets here.

6" at f/22 - Don't see the pattern in camera, but will see what it shows full screen.

Posted 2 years ago #
LRStills

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ok so i shot a concert a few months ago and it was approximately candle light in the venue, you can see the pictures here:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=435480&id=847470423&l=b464510e65

take a look at picture number 57, has this purple band right through the middle..... anyhow all those shots are 6400 to 25600.
number 2 is 25600, has no apparent banding pre or post lightroom.
17 has a band across the bottom of the picture, it's at 25600.

here is a concert picture i took at 12800, zero banding, extremely contrasty lighting, and yet it was chosen by the papers for that concert:
http://ch.tilllate.com/en/photoalbum/overview/10258051#170539468

perhaps the picture you took was a bit over-exposed for that high of ISO, generally if a picture is darker, banding is something one has to look for to find if it's the D700.

Posted 2 years ago #
LRStills

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another thing: removing the 5 blacks in a RAW D700 25600 ISO file with bright light in the shot in Lightroom (3), reveals banding in most shots it seems.

Posted 2 years ago #