where there’s smoke there’s forum fire
Really? Low-end DSLRs should remain for the interchangeable lenses though, right? I mean, a COOLPIX can't do that.
I can see a line of large-sensored COOLPIXes, but I can't see them with interchangeable lenses. That would be pure DSLR realm.
That is, unless the unveil an EVIL spirit (something M9-like) ;^) But I wouldn't call that a COOLPIX.
I don't think they would be classified as Coolpix, unless they go for a smaller sensor than DX. I have a good argument for the larger crop, get so Nikon stops wasting time developing so many useless DX lenses. Just make some F4 FX lenses for consumers and be done with it.
PB PM said:
I have a good argument for the larger crop, get so Nikon stops wasting time developing so many useless DX lenses.
You know, the thing is by making most of its affordable lenses DX-format, Nikon is trapping us in DX. Wouldn't that make our move to FX even more costly? Isn't that their goal?
alphanikonrex said:
Really? Low-end DSLRs should remain for the interchangeable lenses though, right? I mean, a COOLPIX can't do that.
Not yet they can't. Where else would you put a GF1 or E-P3 like Nikon camera? If Nikon goes the Leica X1 route and puts a large sensor in a fixed camera then why would low end users want a DSLR? Most never use more than two lenses tops. They just want a fast compact that gives great image quality with a good zoom range. They could care less if it's an EVIL camera or a DSLR. In fact most would prefer to not worry about buying and switching extra lenses. An EVIL camera is the best of both worlds.
An EVIL Nikon will make more money than an expensive high end "limited edition" digital rangefinder. If they call it a COOLPIX it will help boost the COOLPIX line which is what they need to do it. A pro grade EVIL compact camera however would probably not be called a COOLPIX.
If Nikon goes with a smaller new lens mount for this "EVIL" class they can still have adapters to use fmount lenses.
alphanikonrex said:
You know, the thing is by making most of its affordable lenses DX-format, Nikon is trapping us in DX. Wouldn't that make our move to FX even more costly? Isn't that their goal?
Not really. The F4 line would be the cheap consumer line, the lenses they make money on. Remember if we get these mirrorless cameras they will need different lenses anyway, so those will replace the low cost DX lenses. The DSLR market will be for advanced amateurs/semi-pro and pro photographers, the very people who want, and can afford an F4 line of lenses.
@Niko:
OK, I gotcha. Yes, I see the logic in that—you're right, most people don't want to fuss with changing lenses. So that means that large-sensored COOLPIX would be targeted to consumers, while the entry-level DSLRs would be more as an entryway to more advanced photography, NOT for those who are simply after quality.
NikoDoby said:
Then why should they wast even more time developing a "prescription" crop that only you and hearty want? :^)
They wont be making crop lenses anymore, just FX. I think that 1.2x crop would be for the camera bodies only. It could either be a stop gap measure till the price of FX sensors fall, or for faster FPS, and sports/nature photographers.
alphanikonrex said:
@Niko:
OK, I gotcha. Yes, I see the logic in that—you're right, most people don't want to fuss with changing lenses. So that means that large-sensored COOLPIX would be targeted to consumers, while the entry-level DSLRs would be more as an entryway to more advanced photography, NOT for those who are simply after quality.
We will see what happens. The fact that Panasonic has leap frogged Pentax, Olympus and Sony in Japan with third place sales of the G1,GH1,GF1 series of EVIL cameras seems to indicate that EVIL cameras are a very popular choice and are here to stay.
PB PM said:
It could either be a stop gap measure till the price of FX sensors fall, or for faster FPS, and sports/nature photographers.
Which DX handles perfectly today :^)
Nikon never had to make DX lenses (except for wide I guess). They just did that to be cost effective. I'll bet you Nikon will come up some cheap RX lenses too to trash consumers with ;^)
Again, DSLRs would be for advanced users and pros, no cheap crap lenses needed. DX does not handle it perfectly, IMO the crop is too much, at least for wide angle usage. I mean I would love to have an FX camera, and drop the crop stuff all together, but that isn't likely.
PB PM said:
They wont be making crop lenses anymore, just FX. I think that 1.2x crop would be for the camera bodies only. It could either be a stop gap measure till the price of FX sensors fall, or for faster FPS, and sports/nature photographers.
But why would I want a 1.2 digital zoom in a DSLR at the expense of image quality? The price of full frame sensors can only go down and processors can only go faster. So a prescription crop to get faster fps doesn't make sense. Like I said before the 1.3 canon sports shooters hated that the 1Dmk4 is not full frame. In other words they do have the choice and hate it.
I really don't care what a vocal minority of Canon shooters think about the 1.3x crop. If the cameras didn't sell, Canon wouldn't make them.
PB PM said:
I really don't care what a vocal minority of Canon shooters think about the 1.3x crop. If the cameras didn't sell, Canon wouldn't make them.
I do because if it doesn't work for the "No1" camera company why should Nikon waste time and money on developing another crop? I'd rather they spend it on other things like getting rid of rolling shutter in video. Or on auto focus that can track a butterfly in flight!
We'll see. ;)
NikoDoby said:
I do because if it doesn't work for the "No1" camera company why should Nikon waste time and money on developing another crop? I'd rather they spend it on other things like getting rid of rolling shutter in video. Or on auto focus that can track a butterfly in flight!
Rolling shutter is a problem with CMOS sensors, just look at the CMOS sensor camcorders, they have the same problem. CCD sensors don't have that problem, which is why high end video cameras still use CCDs.
Also, that vocal minority are the people from that #1 camera company don't speak for everyone who buys from them.
*a few weeks later at PMA Nikon shocks the world by announcing it's new 1.3x crop D900 camera! Heartyfisher and PB PM quickly revive this thread with an all caps "FU to all you haters cause we were right!" post*
:^) lol.
lol. Nah, I'm not a "I told you so" kind of guy. :)
PB PM said:
Rolling shutter is a problem with CMOS sensors, just look at the CMOS sensor camcorders, they have the same problem. CCD sensors don't have that problem, which is why high end video cameras still use CCDs.Also, that vocal minority are the people from that #1 camera company don't speak for everyone who buys from them.
Yes I know what rolling shutter is. Rumor has it Nikon might be going to a new high ISO CCD to solve the problem. The point is they won't find a solution if their "wasting time" with prescription crop.
PB PM said:
Also, that vocal minority are the people from that #1 camera company don't speak for everyone who buys from them.
Then why should Nikon care about an even smaller minority that want another crop camera?
Really? Because last time I checked the top three camera companies in the world were Japanese. They must be doing something right. But I guess Thom's opinion is fact now a days.
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