Okay. Here is a set using the 24mm f/1.4 AF-S. Pardon the exposure. D800 is sharper at f/1.4.
Here is the D800E crop.

msmoto said:
So now I am really ........ummm, between a rock and a hard place. A D800 or wait until the D400. Actually, I think I will go with the D800E as a companion to the D4.

I don't think that you'll be disappointed for a second with that combination. Portraits with your 400mm f2.8 and the D800E would be dreamy beyond compare.

I cant think of a photographic assignment, that cannot be tackled with the combination of the a D4 and a D800E

Without any question....once I placed both images on my monitor, then enlarged the monitor image 100%...the D800 is clearly sharper than the D4. And I do agree with the idea it seems to have a better tonal value in regards to color.

So now I am really ........ummm, between a rock and a hard place. A D800 or wait until the D400. Actually, I think I will go with the D800E as a companion to the D4.

So, not fried eyes, just tired. But, I am putting up some sheep to count on PAD, so what the heck...

@SquamishPhoto - I also had the feeling that the color gradients seemed smoother with the D800. Were you able to see any difference in tonal characteristics?

msmoto said:
Gosh, great work.... However, in the "Knot Crop" set, I thought the D4 was sharper, especially on the sculpture itself. However, as TTJ says, this could be my "fried eyes". Or, this might be an artifact of the process, but it demonstrates exactly what I think I believed was true. And, that is, the difference between the two cameras is not very much. The resolution of the D4 is entirely adequate (such a nice word for a D4) for my use.

Again, thank yo so much Eric. This is a really great contribution here on NRF.

I think you might be right about your eyes, msmoto. If you look at the rope in the Knot Crop you can see that the D4 image has a lot less detail in the highlights and shadows and an overall smudgy look to it. At that magnification neither really looks all that good, but the D800E image is certainly sharper, which was expected. And for what its worth my eyes have always been significantly better than 20/20 since I was a child. :]

I was surprised by how similar the results are. However, since the linear pixel pitch is only 1.5x in going from the D4 to the D800, I guess it makes sense. I may give it another try with the 24 f/1.4G at around f/2.0.

I "think" that the body of the knot is sharper with the D800, and the tones may be slightly smoother... What surprises me is how well the enlargement software works.

While I have tried to make sure my technique was correct, I may have made errors so if anyone sees a mistake, let me know.

One thing that is clear to me is that focus, diffraction, motion and lenses can quickly impact any sharpness differences you may see between the cameras.

@msmoto, yeah... The D4 is "adequate"... of the two it's my favorite.

Gosh, great work.... However, in the "Knot Crop" set, I thought the D4 was sharper, especially on the sculpture itself. However, as TTJ says, this could be my "fried eyes". Or, this might be an artifact of the process, but it demonstrates exactly what I think I believed was true. And, that is, the difference between the two cameras is not very much. The resolution of the D4 is entirely adequate (such a nice word for a D4) for my use.

Again, thank yo so much Eric. This is a really great contribution here on NRF.

Maybe my eyes might be fried for the day but I can't tell a bit of "real" difference between the two. There is a contrast difference for sure, very subtle, but that could be the software applying a profile as well.

Nice set of photos!

@SquamishPhoto - Unfortunately no Zeiss glass. (but you have me wishing...) I couldn't get any family members to cooperate, so I grabbed a decoration and set up the lights. 2 flash heads, one was reflected off of an umbrella and the other was pointed towards a light brown wall. I used the 135 DC at ISO 100, f/4, 1/x250, Manual mode. Heavy tripod, wireless remote, photo triggered while in live view. Manual focus using zoomed live view.

Note: the D800E live view focusing under the exact same lighting conditions is significantly noisier than the D4. With the d4, my modeling lights were enough for good live view focusing. With the D800E I had to open up the aperture and turn on the room lights in order to get the zoomed in live view performance I wanted.

I tried to crop the same portion of the image and then I used Perfect Resize to expand the D4 image to roughly the same number of pixels as the D800E crop.

Hopefully these images allow some comparative assessment of tonality. Click through the following image to get to the main images and the 100% crops.

My vote would be studio lit portraits with an 85mm or 135mm lens at native ISO and low ISO to compare tonality.

@msmoto - I added some more description above. I think I'll try another lens, any favorites?

Absolutely PERFECT Eric. I opened two windows, compared side by side, very difficult to say, but, I think maybe with some imagination, the D800 has a bit less noise, although there is almost none at all on either. Sharpness, maybe the D800 shows a difference. I am not certain the difference would be seen except in an enlargement of possibly 30" x 40". Both are so good.

And, thank you very much Eric. Great job!

OK, Same subject. This image will take you to a pair of photos taken with the 105micro AF-S.
Both were shot at f/4 and 1/30s. I chose this aperture to try and stay away from diffraction. Thom Hogan's D800 review implies that a greater difference might even be seen at f/2.8. Both were shot using a stout Gitzo tripod. There was a bit of a breeze which I could see in live view when fully zoomed... I used a wireless remote release to trigger the shutter when the LCD showed a quiet image. The sun was also moving, hence the difference in backgrounds...these were taken at about 6:00pm.

The D800 crop was 843 x 1266 whereas the D4 crop of the same area turned out to be 567 x 851. I sized up the D4 crop to 843 x 1265 using OnOne Software's Perfect Resize.

The easiest place to see the difference is to look at the green Triangular areas between the spines down near where the stem enters the head. Also look at some of the fine features on the spines in the very center of the image. At 200%, the differences are apparent.

However, as can be seen, the D4 is doing a great job... or I am doing a poor job of extracting what the D800 can do.

Thank you for the test

It was late, so I'll give it a better effort tonight. My initial impression is that the D4 holds its own quite well. I prefer the D800E image but that may have something to do with the exposure difference (which I need to run down). I'll duplicate this test with this lens and look at bringing the D800E down to the D4 size.

Thanks, Eric,

How about downloading to Flickr the full size of each image. Maybe you could do some post processing exposure compensation to bring them into the same tonal range. I can see little difference here except the exposure. I suspect at the largest image size, we will see a greater color depth with the D800E.

After looking at the larger photos on Flickr, the biggest difference is in the color from what I see. Maybe at an enlargement of even greater size we will see more significant difference. The D4 seems to really hold its own at the usual sizes.

Okay. Its rough, but its a start.
These images were taken with a D4 and a D800E.
Both cameras set to ISO 100. 1/250s, f/6.3
Lens was a 105 AF-S Micro. The flash system was adjusted manually for exposure by eye on the D4, then left alone.
Focus was accomplished in live view, zoomed in to verify sharpness. Images were shot RAW.
The only adjustment was to set the WB to "Flash" @5500K. Neither camera had any exposure compensation.
Here are the two images:

The individual images can be found be clicking on the photo.

Eric said:

Question: How do we want to do the comparison? I understand keeping the same exposure conditions and lens, but do we size the images to be compared to something like the bounds of a 2000 pixel D800 image (for the D4), or do we do the DXOMark thing and downsize both camera images to around 2000 max dimension?

I'm interested in your thoughts.
Thx

It would seem reasonable to compare the same size final image. Say a 3000px x 2000 px image on Flickr. In addition, of course, a full size image can be done. If the links to the 3000x2000 images are posted, one can open two windows and really get a good comparison of what we (real human photographers) are able to see in a daily photo. So, thanks and I will look forward to what you put up here. I hope some others will actually do the same. I am not around a D800 or D800E at present, so I am sort of out of the loop unless I can convince a stranger to lend me their D800....ha, ha, ha......

I think I would prefer to see both at native largest.

@msmoto
I just picked up my D800E. I still have to check the AF accuracy, but I'm ready to give this a go. I can look at D4 vs D800E. If I'm lucky, I will also be able to get a shot or two from a friends D800.

Question: How do we want to do the comparison? I understand keeping the same exposure conditions and lens, but do we size the images to be compared to something like the bounds of a 2000 pixel D800 image (for the D4), or do we do the DXOMark thing and downsize both camera images to around 2000 max dimension?

I'm interested in your thoughts.
Thx

SquamishPhoto said:
check this review, msmoto - http://mansurovs.com/nikon-d800-review

Great article, but what I am interested in is the results NRF members get from the cameras shooting the exact object with both, same lens, etc. This way it is straight forward and we can look at two images and see exactly what the difference is by our own subjective interpretations.

Still waiting on the D800E... I'd love to participate though...

check this review, msmoto - http://mansurovs.com/nikon-d800-review

Great idea! Bring them on guys!

Unfortunately I can not contribute (D4, D70s, P7100)

Jürgen