Great Kendo shot Gareth! The background realy makes it.

Great summation. Indeed, position is all-important. But so too are a million shots and perseverance. It is a very different photography to artistic photography where you take time and work on perfection. Rather, you anticipate and take shots, but again, it is about timing rather than perfection. Good luck.

Wow, thanks. That was exactly the type of info i was looking for.

I really agree thats its all about Skill, less about the camera.

The hockey shot i linked to above was actually shot with my D60, so 3 af points, 3 fps, ISO 800 1/160 f4.5. I saw the play build before it happened and was lucky one of my 3fps's was on it.

It really boils down to shooting a lot, but i strongly disagree that "Generally, you just fire off a million shots whilst at a football match and pick the best and send it off, "

Last week i shot this game:

http://www.theconcordian.com/sports/stingers-start-the-new-year-on-a-losing-note-1.1837817

where i was not feeling well and didn't sleep much, i shot as much as usual(600-ish shots over 2 hours) but got very crappy results. I didn't have to wait till i got home to know. Sports photography is all about position, you have to know where to be to get the right shot, and have to know and read the play and be ready before the play happens, as they say: "if you saw it, you didn't get it".

I consider sports photography as much a sport as what i'm shooting, when im off, i see perfect shots go right through the viewfinder. And you can never shoot everything.

Drab said:
That wasn't a normal basketball game setup though, was it?

No. It was the finals. You can tell by the "special" parking rate:

Drab said:
huh, I've just never noticed any sort of strobes behind the glass during regulation play.

Yeah, I'm not sure where the strobes were--that was just a guess. The Foamcore may have been used just to eliminate reflections of the camera bodies.

Sports photography, especially sports photography used with fixed cameras is ALL about the equipment and timing, not the artist. Generally, you just fire off a million shots whilst at a football match and pick the best and send it off, but do it mad quick as everyone is doing the same. Photography and sports photography should be put into different categories completely as one really is science and one is soul. I suppose there is some runover, but by and large, sports photography is populated by professionals (people making money by photography), so it is not a -how to- take better photos subject, it is a -must- take perfect photos for the occasion subject.

Ive been told by a sports photographer that some stadiums have built in lighting systems and when the photographer fires it triggers it. Bring your own pocketwizard next time and try it. Agreed that the equipment has a lot to do with the ability to get good shots especially at hockey games, especially at the majority of stadiums that don't have that "system"

huh, I've just never noticed any sort of strobes behind the glass during regulation play.

Thanks for the context!

Drab said:
That wasn't a normal basketball game setup though, was it? That looks like prep for the slam-dunk contest part of All Star week.

Last year Mark Terrill posted some pictures on Facebook of him shooting the NBA playoffs. It was much the same as studio460 posted with the controls and etc. He was free to roam with remotes and he shot all over the place, even from the rafters. He had pictures of the assist equipment he needed and it literally took a U-Haul truck to handle that much equipment. I'm sure every year the assist equipment changes with technology but I had no idea that the big dogs had that much equipment assisting them, it was really impressive.

That wasn't a normal basketball game setup though, was it? That looks like prep for the slam-dunk contest part of All Star week.

Agree with Adam on this one. The issue here doesn't seem to be the photographer (Gelu), who's getting results that are probably about the best you could expect from the gear being used. So if the photographer's not the weak link, that leaves the gear.

I believe as much as the next person that the person behind the camera is what "makes" the photo. But if the equipment truly made no difference, we'd all be walking around with Brownies or Polaroids around our necks. Who'd need or want a Leica, Nikon, or Canon, after all, when "superior" results could be gotten with much cheaper gear? Jared made a similar point on another thread; the equipment DOES make a difference, and it's silly to pretend that it doesn't. Just don't pretend the equipment is going to be a substitute for the mental/creative side of it.

Don't believe me?

LoveTheBerry said:
I agree with Gareth,...Sporting events and a D3s, and fast glass are a great combination.

As you're implicitly stating here, sometimes it IS the gear.

LoveTheBerry said:
80% of the shot is the photographer and his/her skills
20% of the shot is the equipment used (properly)

I agree with Gareth,...Sporting events and a D3s, and fast glass are a great combination.

*Studio,...great picture. Never really thought about all that goes into prep of a basketball ame.

have to disagree with You, I would say that right now to get a good shoot You need good equipment, sure the photographer is still the main factor but w/o the latests equipment You can't get "this" shot

LoveTheBerry said:
Studio,...great picture. Never really thought about all that goes into prep of a basketball game.

Thanks! Yes, I was certainly impressed! Courtside, I'd never seen so many 300mm f/2.8s and 200-400mm Nikon zooms in one place! There were actually quite a few Nikon shooters there.

80% of the shot is the photographer and his/her skills
20% of the shot is the equipment used (properly)

I agree with Gareth,...Sporting events and a D3s, and fast glass are a great combination.

*Studio,...great picture. Never really thought about all that goes into prep of a basketball ame.

I have to say, ice hockey looks like a very hard sport to photograph!

What you need, and I'm sure you know,is money.

The best combo for you would be 200/2 and a D3s. I use a 300 2.8 and a d700 for kendo and get results like this without flash (not allowed);

1/320 (pulsing lights) 300mm 2.8 (wide) ISO 2500. Shot in 14bit RAW and edited in lightroom.

You are doing well to get those results, but you wont do better with that kit.

FlashWizard II controllers.

Camera rigging for FlashWizard II-synched bodies.

It appears that this photographer gaff-taped a Foamcore softbox to the backboard for his strobe.

I happened to find the perfect caption to the photos above, while searching for the product pictured, "The FlashWizard II system is for very specific work such as rigging multiple remote cameras to fire in-sync with one strobe firing (can you say NBA finals?)." --posted by Walter Calahan, SportsShooter.com

Whoops! It's no longer manufactured! Listen to this, "My understanding is that SI (and probably NBAE) pretty much bought out the remaining stock of FlashWizard IIs, and, as Anthony points out, it is no longer manufactured." --posted by Thom Kendall, SportsShooter.com.

Must be true, since these photos were taken in 2010, and the posts were written back in 2008. You can't really tell from these photos, but they had a TON of bodies mounted to those backboards and supports.

makes sense, im just surprised at the power required to light up such a huge space. also i figure they have limitations over how often they can do it.

I didn't mention my lens on purpose as i knew it would sidetrack the discussion, i use a 55-200, i usually end up shooting around f/5 because of the focal lengths i need. I'm well aware of the limitation i'm working with, but i get some decent results.
http://www.theconcordian.com/sports/four-wins-in-a-row-for-the-men-s-hockey-team-1.1775698

one of these days when there's 2-3 different sports back to back i'll go out and rent a 70-200 for a weekend. Too bad the paper doesn't pay me.

Generally, the pros use a couple of studio strobes bounced off the roof. They need to get permission to do this, and have insurance to cover any possible accident.

They also have fast lenses. You didn't say what lens you are using.

So ive always watched lots of hockey, but recently i've noticed the photographers on the side, one of them always has some sort of pocketwizard type thing on and i'm pretty sure i'm seeing some sort of flash going on everywhere when he fires.

Also, i've been shooting university hockey on a weekly basis for a bit, and with my D7000 at ISO 1600 1/500. Im getting nowhere near the images they are. They must have some sort of additional lighting right? Anyone know how its set up, how it works, how it doesn't affect the players etc?